Cummins caught emissions cheating - fined 1.67 billion mega thread.

[g00fy]

I wonder if this whole situation is what's been holding up Banks from releasing the new Derringer for the Cummins.

 

[John Jensen]

My brother just received a recall A67 for the 2016 HO he sold a year ago. It appears to be a software change resulting from the Cummins violation. I've not received anything for my 2020 HO.

 

[DougB]

My brother just received a recall A67 for the 2016 HO he sold a year ago. It appears to be a software change resulting from the Cummins violation. I've not received anything for my 2020 HO.

A quick Google search and it looks like this is an extension of the VB6 2019 recall and applies to the 2013-2018 MYs.

 

[OLEJOE]

I’m going to tag in as Im curious how this is going to unfold.

 

[MtnRider]

I wonder if this whole situation is what's been holding up Banks from releasing the new Derringer for the Cummins.

it's coming soon! .... wait, he has been saying that for 6+ years now. Lol This issue not holding him up.

.

 

[OLEJOE]

My truck got some kind of an ECM update in Oct of 22. Have no idea what that was. It was still on the lot at the dealership

 

[Nick]

There are certain rural counties in Cali that don't require emissions testing .

 

[CaptainMike]

There are certain rural counties in Cali that don't require emissions testing .

Yep, and I live in one of them....

 

[OLEJOE]

Do y’all think this may be a back door to finding out which trucks have been deleted?

 

[Enve46]

Do y’all think this may be a back door to finding out which trucks have been deleted?

Doubtful but then again, anything is possible. I have seen several on FB post their notices in the trash stating they wont take their truck in for it, so there wouldn't be a way to confirm it.

 

[OLEJOE]

You don’t think there is a way to see a vehicle being registered and update not completed ?

 

[MtnRider]

Do y’all think this may be a back door to finding out which trucks have been deleted?

No....

But the conspiracy theories are running rampant though. I've seen FB posts claiming everything from they are going to lock all the ECM's (not happening) to, I got mine done and lost 3+ mpg, They are going to de-tune the truck and you'll lose 100HP and another claiming their DEF usage went up 30%

While I suspect your DEF usage may go up because of this (from everything I have learned about it) I highly doubt it will be a 30% increase in usage, the rest of it is tinfoil hat stuff...

.

 

[OLEJOE]

No....

But the conspiracy theories are running rampant though. I've seen FB posts claiming everything from they are going to lock all the ECM's (not happening) to, I got mine done and lost 3+ mpg, They are going to de-tune the truck and you'll lose 100HP and another claiming their DEF usage went up 30%

While I suspect your DEF usage may go up because of this (from everything I have learned about it) I highly doubt it will be a 30% increase in usage, the rest of it is tinfoil hat stuff...

.

I thought it might be DEF and/or EGR related. Mine just seems to sip DEF so Im sure the usage will increase.

 

[rfullen280]

Recall databases are public knowledge.
Some states/jurisdictions will not let you register, sell, transfer, or trade a vehicle that has not had all safety recalls completed. (I linked some of that info further up the chain).
If you have modified your vehicle systems, it's possible that you may never be able to complete recalls (can't reflash what isn't there).
The dealer software takes a snapshot of the systems that are equipped, the firmware they are running, and puts that in the Stellantis database (and maybe Stellantis doesn't care what you do...)
Dealers, manufacturers have been liable to the government in the past for violations of EPA and Clean Air Act (if they weren't, then explain this 1.6 bajillion dollar "settlement).
Now, knowing all of that - who do you think a manufacturer or dealer is going to support more... you, the customer or ... the big bureaucratic legal powerhouse that can fine them billions of dollars, and can put them out of business?

Regardless of changes in EGR/DEF usage... who in the industry really gives a crap about you as an individual?

After the Industrial Revolution - the next big revolution is the DATA revolution. And data is more valuable than gold. https://www.undatarevolution.org/data-revolution/ This is not a conspiracy theory, this is a fact.

So, approximately 1 MILLION diesel trucks are being recalled for safety/emissions/etc... tell me they're not using a database. Hell, I'm mildly stupid sometimes, and I can sort 10,000 lines on a database by firmware signature version.

 

[OLEJOE]

Recall databases are public knowledge.
Some states/jurisdictions will not let you register, sell, transfer, or trade a vehicle that has not had all safety recalls completed. (I linked some of that info further up the chain).
If you have modified your vehicle systems, it's possible that you may never be able to complete recalls (can't reflash what isn't there).
The dealer software takes a snapshot of the systems that are equipped, the firmware they are running, and puts that in the Stellantis database (and maybe Stellantis doesn't care what you do...)
Dealers, manufacturers have been liable to the government in the past for violations of EPA and Clean Air Act (if they weren't, then explain this 1.6 bajillion dollar "settlement).
Now, knowing all of that - who do you think a manufacturer or dealer is going to support more... you, the customer or ... the big bureaucratic legal powerhouse that can fine them billions of dollars, and can put them out of business?

Regardless of changes in EGR/DEF usage... who in the industry really gives a crap about you as an individual?

After the Industrial Revolution - the next big revolution is the DATA revolution. And data is more valuable than gold. https://www.undatarevolution.org/data-revolution/ This is not a conspiracy theory, this is a fact.

So, approximately 1 MILLION diesel trucks are being recalled for safety/emissions/etc... tell me they're not using a database. Hell, I'm mildly stupid sometimes, and I can sort 10,000 lines on a database by firmware signature version.

I think it’s also known as the Paperless Revolution.

 

[Brutal_HO]

No....

But the conspiracy theories are running rampant though. I've seen FB posts claiming everything from they are going to lock all the ECM's (not happening) to, I got mine done and lost 3+ mpg, They are going to de-tune the truck and you'll lose 100HP and another claiming their DEF usage went up 30%

While I suspect your DEF usage may go up because of this (from everything I have learned about it) I highly doubt it will be a 30% increase in usage, the rest of it is tinfoil hat stuff...

.

At least one FB respondent has confirmed several trucks flashed with the recall have already been re-flashed with a tune so ya, that PCM lock thing isn't happening.

I think it's the knuckleheads that still think FCA locked 21 PCM's when it was just a different stock flash PN and additional checksums that the tuners had to work with.

Funny how it just takes one tuner (or user) to Chicken Little something and now it's forever the truth on the intarwebs.

 

[rfullen280]

I think it’s also known as the Paperless Revolution.

At least one FB respondent has confirmed several trucks flashed with the recall have already been re-flashed with a tune so ya, that PCM lock thing isn't happening.

I think it's the knuckleheads that still think FCA locked 21 PCM's when it was just a different stock flash PN and additional checksums that the tuners had to work with.

Funny how it just takes one tuner (or user) to Chicken Little something and now it's forever the truth on the intarwebs.

Ya, there's no way they can electronically "lock" the hardware... or at least not one that would make it damn near impossible for the OEM to service the hardware themselves. Would require a fundamental change in the hardware itself.

Here's why can't have the recall done - it'll flag some missing components...

 

[John Jensen]

At least one FB respondent has confirmed several trucks flashed with the recall have already been re-flashed with a tune so ya, that PCM lock thing isn't happening.

Did the FB responder reference a recall ID? How did he confirm?

I seriously doubt there's a current recall issued relative to the recent Cummins violation. Cummins hasn't had time enough to develop and get EPA approval.

 

[rfullen280]

Not sure - there isn't one when I search my VIN, however - https://investor.cummins.com/news/d...s-agreement-in-principle-to-settle-regulatory

From midway down the press release: "Cummins disclosed a review of these matters when it began in 2019 and has regularly updated its disclosures as that review progressed. The company has already recalled model year 2019 RAM 2500 and 3500 trucks and has initiated a recall of model years 2013 through 2018 RAM 2500 and 3500 trucks and previously accrued a total of $59 million for the estimated costs for executing these and other related recalls."

The "violation" isn't new. The settlement is.

 

[rfullen280]

And there's a long history of Cummins keeping CARB (California Air Resources Board) employed. https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/search/site?keys=cummins#gsc.tab=0&gsc.q=cummins&gsc.sort=