Trail_Wagon: The story of "Hope". A 2022 power wagon build

[Trail_Wagon]

One other shock package to consider that doesn't exist yet is Thuren's Fox 2.5 DSC. I've been holding out for this in order to have the adjustability ...

https://www.facebook.com/232671426774560/posts/4176648359043494

I remember seeing this on Instagram, unfortunately its been two years and still not available.

 

[Trail_Wagon]

I ordered one of these this morning. I like the location up away from water and it seems like good use of empty space. I'll be mounting an ARB dual compressor here and plumbing a line to the front bumper for airing up tires and a line to the rear for control of the airbags. $150 is highway robbery for what it is, but I have to be realistic... I'm more than capable of fabricating this bracket but I just don't have the time.

19+ Ram 2500/3500 HD 6.4L Compressor Mount

With a proven track record of reliability, NH Overland proudly introduces the Passenger Side Compressor Mount designed specifically for 19+ Ram 2500/3500 6.4L Hemi-powered trucks with a single battery. This innovative mount offers configurations for ARB Twin, ARB Single, Rough Country Twin, and...

www.nhoverland.com

 

[UglyViking]

The inside vs outside of the frame rails is the primary reason I'm looking at doing the bags with cradles. The Carli dominator kit is def interesting for the same reason, but I wonder how the ride is for a daily. I've got no experience, so just a question.

I went with the coil 2500 for the reason that I wanted the off trail articulation more than any high speed travel.

I can also vouch for the added stability of the JL vs the JK. I bought my wife a JL a few years ago (first year) and noticed instantly that it was vastly better than my old JK (2010 model).

I think that with any high center of gravity load, bags are an absolute must, if only for the stability.

 

[Trail_Wagon]

The inside vs outside of the frame rails is the primary reason I'm looking at doing the bags with cradles. The Carli dominator kit is def interesting for the same reason, but I wonder how the ride is for a daily. I've got no experience, so just a question.

I went with the coil 2500 for the reason that I wanted the off trail articulation more than any high speed travel.

I can also vouch for the added stability of the JL vs the JK. I bought my wife a JL a few years ago (first year) and noticed instantly that it was vastly better than my old JK (2010 model).

I think that with any high center of gravity load, bags are an absolute must, if only for the stability.

I agree with everything. Even if I had purchased a 3500, I would still put airbags. The truck isn't designed to ride nose up. Especially with a radius arm suspension the caster changes are pretty extreme.

 

[Hayduke]

We had a Scout Kenai on a 2016 Ram 2500 with the Cummins that we just recently sold to move to a Power Wagon + Go Fast Camper. Even on the standard 2500 suspension the truck needed a Hellwig swaybar and Timbrens to feel like the sway was under control. Not sure if you got the rooftop tent option on your Kenai but it really raises the center of gravity up high and makes the sway worse. It was a sweet camper but I'd be worried that it's a bit too much for a PW.

 

[Trail_Wagon]

I did not go with the rooftop tent. So that will help. If I find the truck to have to much sway, this is the plan in order...
1. Airbags. More stability than timbrens. I'm already planning on these.
2. Upgraded Hellwig sway bar if needed
3. Factory 2500 radius arms... One or both if needed. I can have them swapped out in an hour.Turns the front axle into a giant anti sway bar.
At this point you have a regular 2500 with airbags.

4. Carlie radius arms... Essentially replaces the frame side bushing with a Johny joint. Even less flex/sway.

I think the airbags will be enough, but we will see.

 

[Dingo]

Every time I see the title of this thread I think of Star Wars...

 

[Trail_Wagon]

Every time I see the title of this thread I think of Star Wars...

 

[Hayduke]

I did not go with the rooftop tent. So that will help. If I find the truck to have to much sway, this is the plan in order...
1. Airbags. More stability than timbrens. I'm already planning on these.
2. Upgraded Hellwig sway bar if needed
3. Factory 2500 radius arms... One or both if needed. I can have them swapped out in an hour.Turns the front axle into a giant anti sway bar.
At this point you have a regular 2500 with airbags.

4. Carlie radius arms... Essentially replaces the frame side bushing with a Johny joint. Even less flex/sway.

I think the airbags will be enough, but we will see.

Sounds like a good plan, I hope you get the suspension dialed in to your liking. I'm curious why you think airbags provide more stability than the timbrens? Also curious about your comment that the Johnny joints reduces flex vs the OEM frame side bushing? My impression was that the Carli arms provided better flex than the factory radius arms (standard arms, not the PW ones) but I could be wrong.

 

[UglyViking]

I don't know that Airbags are going to have much noticeable improvement on timbrens unless that bag is at max inflation. I believe they both mount in the same spot so you're not getting any difference in mechanical advantage there, just potentially hardness of the support.

I think the Carli radius arms are likely to provide less stability, not more, again if it's noticeable. While the Carli arms are surely stronger than the factory arms the spherical joint is going to allow for greater movement in the lateral (or side to side) direction. It also won't store any energy while articulating, so perhaps that is what OP means.

 

[Trail_Wagon]

Timbrens are fine, but they are essentially a long bump stop. Airbags are adjustable allow you to maintain ride height, so there is no caster change when the truck squats, Also when the bags are empty ride quality is unchanged. The bags are as far towards the wheels as possible, giving a lot of side to side stability. So, to correct my previous statement, Airbags might not offer much additional stability over timbrens since they mount in the same spot.

The front radius arm suspension requires rubber bushings to flex. not up and down, but one side higher than the other.. The PW arms have one more rubber bushing than stock 2500 ones do... this allows for the extra articulation. The Carlie arms have a JJ on the frame side, so thats one less bushing to stretch. Its probably not a huge difference, but it adds up. If all joints were heims or johnny joints, the front axle would only be able to move up and down, with no flex at all. Eventually, it just tears the mounts off the axle or frame.

As far as I can tell, the only benefit for the Carlie arms is tighter handling and clearance for tires.

 

[UglyViking]

Apologies, I completely spaced this conversation was in regards to a PW which has the Articulink front arms. You're right then that the Carli arms will likely provide a bit more stability, not sure how much, but likely noticeable.

I realize it may be a bit late in the game for this comment but you likely would have been better off with a base 2500 as you're seeking to remove more and more of what makes the PW unique. I'd just say be careful of how far down that road you go as at some point it may make sense to just swap your PW for a standard 2500, unless of course the sway bar disconnect is a big pull.

 

[Trail_Wagon]

Apologies, I completely spaced this conversation was in regards to a PW which has the Articulink front arms. You're right then that the Carli arms will likely provide a bit more stability, not sure how much, but likely noticeable.

I realize it may be a bit late in the game for this comment but you likely would have been better off with a base 2500 as you're seeking to remove more and more of what makes the PW unique. I'd just say be careful of how far down that road you go as at some point it may make sense to just swap your PW for a standard 2500, unless of course the sway bar disconnect is a big pull.

I've had this same thought several times, and have really given this a lot of consideration. I've confident in my decision that the Power Wagon is the right choice for my build. I'm not expecting to replace the radius arms, but its an option if needed. I have a full shop, and the knowledge and skills to align a live axle vehicle myself, Swapping arms would just be part of prep before going on vacation. Realistically, Hope will be spending 95% of her time empty one the streets and exploring the back country. I'm going to make a few mods to increase her capacity, without reducing her capability.

I'm pretty knowledgeable about 3, 4, and 5 link suspensions, but honestly, I've never used a radius arm setup before, it was always easier to build a 3 link front. So I'm still learning about them. If I post something incorrect about a radius arm, let me know. Here's a pic of the 4 link rear I'm finishing up on my TJ.





The sway bar disconnect is actually a big deal. When disconnected the front axle can move independently of the body allowing for greater flex and articulation, which is great for off road, but what they don't tell you is how much it improves the ride. It goes from violently tossing the vehicle around side to side to being very smooth. The difference is night and day. On the very rocky terrain I frequent, I cringe watching the HD trucks lumber along at 3 mph. Every bump and small rock throwing the truck and its passengers around. I'm always surprised the YouTube guys never mention it.

These is another side of this coin. I own a jeep rental business in Sedona. This truck is replacing my gladiator which is the primary recovery vehicle for whenever a mechanical problem happens or someone gets stuck. The truck has to be just as capable as a Rubicon, so it can get them out of trouble if needed. So lockers... an absolute must. Winch... an absolute must. Sway bar... an absolute must. I think of the Power Wagon as a Gladiator on steroids. Nearly as capable off road, but with the ability to tow and haul heavier and larger loads. Here's the Gladiator I'm replacing.

 

[UglyViking]

I've had this same thought several times, and have really given this a lot of consideration. I've confident in my decision that the Power Wagon is the right choice for my build. I'm not expecting to replace the radius arms, but its an option if needed. I have a full shop, and the knowledge and skills to align a live axle vehicle myself, Swapping arms would just be part of prep before going on vacation. Realistically, Hope will be spending 95% of her time empty one the streets and exploring the back country. I'm going to make a few mods to increase her capacity, without reducing her capability.

I'm pretty knowledgeable about 3, 4, and 5 link suspensions, but honestly, I've never used a radius arm setup before, it was always easier to build a 3 link front. So I'm still learning about them. If I post something incorrect about a radius arm, let me know. Here's a pic of the 4 link rear I'm finishing up on my TJ.

View attachment 32497



The sway bar disconnect is actually a big deal. When disconnected the front axle can move independently of the body allowing for greater flex and articulation, which is great for off road, but what they don't tell you is how much it improves the ride. It goes from violently tossing the vehicle around side to side to being very smooth. The difference is night and day. On the very rocky terrain I frequent, I cringe watching the HD trucks lumber along at 3 mph. Every bump and small rock throwing the truck and its passengers around. I'm always surprised the YouTube guys never mention it.

These is another side of this coin. I own a jeep rental business in Sedona. This truck is replacing my gladiator which is the primary recovery vehicle for whenever a mechanical problem happens or someone gets stuck. The truck has to be just as capable as a Rubicon, so it can get them out of trouble if needed. So lockers... an absolute must. Winch... an absolute must. Sway bar... an absolute must. I think of the Power Wagon as a Gladiator on steroids. Nearly as capable off road, but with the ability to tow and haul. Here's the Gladiator I'm replacing.

View attachment 32498

You likely have far more experience and knowledge in the off road suspension world than me, but if anything stands out I'll surely comment on it.

I can def see the value is the disconnecting sway bar, but I always wonder why not just manually disconnect it if that is the only thing stopping you? Obviously automatic is far nicer, but manual isn't that hard if you're going to be off road all day. I know a lot of guys will just straight up remove them.

I'm running a 2500 cummins and I can't wait for Nitro to release gearing and for ARB to release lockers. Those gladiators are dope trucks too, I almost ended up with one before we decided on getting a travel trailer.

 

[Trail_Wagon]

And she showed up today!

 

[Etoimos]

And she showed up today!

Sweet truck and awesome photos!

 

[Trail_Wagon]

Initial Impressions

This is a bad ass truck. It rides a lot nicer than I expected from a HD truck. Tires have been inflated to 55F/45R, around town and on the highway its impressively smooth. The speed bumps at the store and gym are drama free. A lot of people bash the Bilstein shocks, but for around town they are nice. You know your driving a truck but I'm very pleased!

Power is smooth and ample... and love that Hemi rumble, even just idling in the driveway. Its been too long since I've had a V8. The level 3 interior is beautiful, leather everywhere, every surface feels expensive. It just feels right in there. Everything is in the right spot. 12" u connect is responsive and intuitive, especially coming from the u connect of the Gladiator and Wrangler. cup holders everywhere!

She's a big girl! I used to drive ambulances and fire trucks so the size isn't intimidating, but its been a while so there's a learning curve... Especially parking. I've almost fallen getting out, and my daily rig is a JL with a 4" lift and 37's. She's a big girl! A quick look underneath and wow, everything is super sized. 5 link rear all looks right, but are those 3" bushings? The suspension is huge. The driveshaft blew my mind. I also wasn't expecting the radius arms to be like 4 feet long! (and to hang down so low... I expect they will meet lots of nice rocks.) Impressive machine.

Haven't gotten to go off road yet because Sedona decided to have a snow storm and the forest service closed all of the local trails.

 

[Rockcrawlindude]

Sweet rig.

 

[Trail_Wagon]

And let's get this party started...

 

[Hibiki54]

This is pretty cool because almost everything you are doing with your PW is exactly what I'm doing with mine. Except you are doing it all at once.

Also, are you going with the Carli Radius Arms?