Kindly help me choose between Standard and High Output Cummins

[Pearce]

This is a fun read so far. With a hobby in offroad/rock crawling I would put more focus on suspension characteristics than an HO vs SO. Obviously if money is not an issue to be able to set it up any way you want it doesn't matter. But, I'd rather have the 2500 coils and link rear suspension over 3500 leaf springs. All personal preference but overlanding treacherous mountain passes I'd want the best preforming and conformable suspension. You will get tired of being knocked around if your suspension isn't dialed.

 

[AH64ID]

Defuels on shifts. I'm sure the 68RFE does it too, maybe just not as noticeable. I can feel the power loss during shifts under hard acceleration.

Full torque also isn't available in the lower gears, likely 1-3.

Being a MD trans the Aisin will shift slower.

 

[UglyViking]

I simply compared the SRW payloads on the SO and HO trucks on the towing chart. Regardless of cab/bed configuration there was a 160lb payload loss on an Aisin when the GVWR was the same.

Very much apples to oranges, but also apples to unicorns since there isn't a 5th gen HD truck yet.

There are simply too many variable in fuel economy, but the power required won't be any different between two trucks that weigh the same so it's really hard to imagine an appreciable difference in economy from tuning and piston differences under normal driving, and the tuning is pretty similar in the cruise range.

I'll have to see if I can dig and find some hard numbers, but 160lbs may be 100% right. In which case, it's still notable, but not crazy (~5% of a 3500 payload I think?)

As far as fuel econ. I don't know man, I'd think the same but from all those who have the Aisin and compare it appears the SO beats the HO by a few MPG. Might not be crazy, but it's there.

And yeah, I love my unicorn 5th gen. It's the only one they made, crazy I got it! haha

I don't notice any "shift flare" on my 2020 HO. You most certainly notice the torque management on shifts.

I for sure have noticed the defueling, but at times you can feel the shift flare, at least I have. I'm trying to recall when I experienced it, but I just recall thinking "oh hey, there it was". I'm pretty sure it was while unloaded, but I honestly could have had the 5er behind me, idk maybe my mind is playing tricks on me. It's also a 2014 DRW HO, so it's very possible that they have adjusting the tuning since my truck came out.

 

[BikePilot]

I live at altitude in Colorado. The 68 (SO) trans does not hold up in steep, tight work with a heavy load. Get the HO or budget for a built 68. I went for the HO and love it.

Thuren has everything you need to make the suspension awesome. The 3500 is the right choice for controlling a load in the mountains. The 2500's inboard mounted springs don't control sway very well. It also has pitiful payload for a HD truck.

 

[GrtPyr]

My initial reaction when I read the first post was shave a little weight and get a 2500 SO like the Rebel which is a sharp looking rig that seemed a bit more off-road oriented with better suspension for that purpose. I have a CCLB HO that I chose for other uses and would not relish the thought of taking it off road in the manner you described. With that said, other members with more knowledge than me have brought up some good points.

It kinda sounds like you are going to be modifying whatever you purchase whether it be 2500 or 3500, SO or HO so it may be up to you if you want to spend the money on the transmission or spend the money on the suspension but the $3k you would spend on the HO option would go quite a ways toward building a mildly upgraded 68RFE of you needed to down the road. I certainly don't think you need the power that comes with it.

 

[aogmitch]

My son had a '22 3500 HO, and after the Aisin failed the 2nd time, and they gave him a 4-6 week date before they could get a new trans, he traded it for a SO '23. Both are Limited's. These are the differences he noticed. He does tow a 30'+ travel trailer at times. The HO was noticeably stronger, as it should be. The SO is getting 2-3 mpg more when running empty (low 20's at 70), and about the same when loaded. The HO started instantly after hitting the start button. The SO cranks a bit longer, cold and warm. The 68RFE gets a lot warmer when driving the forest service roads in the mountains, but still in acceptable limits. He said that there is a lot less turbo lag/quicker throttle response on the SO. These are just a few of the things he has told me about. Both trucks are pretty similar with options.

 

[John Jensen]

My son had a '22 3500 HO, and after the Aisin failed the 2nd time, and they gave him a 4-6 week date before they could get a new trans, he traded it for a SO '23. Both are Limited's. These are the differences he noticed. He does tow a 30'+ travel trailer at times. The HO was noticeably stronger, as it should be. The SO is getting 2-3 mpg more when running empty (low 20's at 70), and about the same when loaded. The HO started instantly after hitting the start button. The SO cranks a bit longer, cold and warm. The 68RFE gets a lot warmer when driving the forest service roads in the mountains, but still in acceptable limits. He said that there is a lot less turbo lag/quicker throttle response on the SO. These are just a few of the things he has told me about. Both trucks are pretty similar with options.

Your son's findings are the same as most people have reported. Thanks for sharing

 

[SilentE]

Interesting thread. I have a dedicated (hard side composite on frame) overland camper on a 2020 3500 Laramie with the HO/Aisin. I bought it used so didn’t have a choice, but liking it alot so far. What a motor after owning a 2006 power stroke for many years!
New member and loving this forum….

 

[flan]

Interesting thread. I have a dedicated (hard side composite on frame) overland camper on a 2020 3500 Laramie with the HO/Aisin. I bought it used so didn’t have a choice, but liking it alot so far. What a motor after owning a 2006 power stroke for many years!
New member and loving this forum….

Cool looking truck from your avatar pic, share some more when you can!

 

[cruzinZ]

I'm documenting my buying process here. But this is a specific drivetrain question which is very appropriate in this esteemed forum. This is my use case:

1. Overlanding Vehicle. Living at 8000ft of elevation. Heavy Winter.
2. Lots of offroad climbing (and descending) in treacherous mountain passes in Colorado.
3. Not a daily driver. Will be use for short trips in the weekends and longer trips (3-6h each way + roaming in the trip) likely once a month.
4. Calculated payload needed including bumpers, roof racks, rock sliders around 2500lbs.

I have decided for a Diesel, so there's no point in talking about the Hemi. But I want to be able to objectively decide about standard vs high output. Saving $3k is fine, but money is no object. Here's the main criteria I'm considering, in equal weightings:

1. Fuel economy
2. Reliability and Longevity
3. Performance for my use case

It's hard to find comparisons, specially long term. I appreciate if you guys have any insights, first hand experience, links to other resources, and everything else you think can help me make an objective decision.

Thanks a lot.

From what I’ve learned the really big decision is if you want the 68RFE or the Aisin transmission. The Aisin is a medium duty transmission while the 68RFE is more of a lighter duty transmission. The 68 will shift much faster and if you’re going to be to be towing less than 15k lbs it’s the better one for normal daily use. If you’re going to be hauling heavy it’s a nobrainer to go with the Aisin. This transmission shifts much slower and you will feel the truck surge slightly between shifts due to the slower shifting. It’s considered the bulletproof choice for those that tow the majority of the time. Standard maintenance will be SIGNIFICANTLY more expensive than the 68. $300 every 60,000 miles vs $600 every 30,000 miles with the Aisin.

Test drive both and make the decision. But if you’re not hauling heavy loads the general consensus is save your money and skip the high output. I was in the same situation when researching and thought HO since it’s going to be my main tow rig. After more research I’m thinking that the standard engine and 68RFE is the better option for me.

 

[Brutal_HO]

From what I’ve learned the really big decision is if you want the 68RFE or the Aisin transmission. The Aisin is a medium duty transmission while the 68RFE is more of a lighter duty transmission. The 68 will shift much faster and if you’re going to be to be towing less than 15k lbs it’s the better one for normal daily use. If you’re going to be hauling heavy it’s a nobrainer to go with the Aisin. This transmission shifts much slower and you will feel the truck surge slightly between shifts due to the slower shifting. It’s considered the bulletproof choice for those that tow the majority of the time. Standard maintenance will be SIGNIFICANTLY more expensive than the 68. $300 every 60,000 miles vs $600 every 30,000 miles with the Aisin.

Test drive both and make the decision. But if you’re not hauling heavy loads the general consensus is save your money and skip the high output. I was in the same situation when researching and thought HO since it’s going to be my main tow rig. After more research I’m thinking that the standard engine and 68RFE is the better option for me.

It's not $600 every 30K.

Aisin service interval is fluid every 30K, filter every 60K.

 

[TigerRP]

My 2020 SO is silky smooth and responsive. I had the 2018 HO and it was definitely less responsive.

But for Colorado I’d go HO for the heavy duty transmission and maybe more important is the exhaust brake on the HO comes on stronger and stays on longer and that may help ya going over Black Bear Pass!

 

[Brutal_HO]

My 2020 SO is silky smooth and responsive. I had the 2018 HO and it was definitely less responsive.

But for Colorado I’d go HO for the heavy duty transmission and maybe more important is the exhaust brake on the HO comes on stronger and stays on longer and that may help ya going over Black Bear Pass!

Mine does Wolf Creek like a boss.