CP4 to CP-ISB21S3 (revised CP3) change for 2021 6.7L Diesel Trucks -- Merged Threads

[g00fy]

23 pages of multiple people speculating and debating what Ram should, will, shouldn't, or won't do. Is any of this really productive? Will it make a difference? Probably not.

Probably not, but welcome to the discussion, we're glad to have you as part of the first 23 pages.

 

[LossPrev]

Let's turn down the sanctimonious rhetoric just a notch please.

Not going to lie, I had to look up what sanctimonious even meant. I'm not trying to act morally superior to anyone here. I just don't understand this Ram/Cummins will replace every cp4 idea. Doesn't seem realistic based on any historical evidence.

Also, the "Ram has wronged me and my truck is a piece of garbage now" mentality is growing to be common in this and many other threads, by owners that have had zero issues with their cp4 and very likely never will.

 

[Xflight29]

All your doing is assuming what FCA will come up with. Assumptions are nothing other than false fiction.

 

[Deleted member 80]

Yeah, they are changing pumps because they need the practice.

 

[kobra]

All your doing is assuming what FCA will come up with. Assumptions are nothing other than false fiction.

You stating that something is false with no evidence is, what - false?? If you're going to challenge something as false due to lack of evidence, perhaps you should bring some evidence of your own.

In this case, I agree that no one can know what FCA will do -they likely don't yet know what they will do. But let's get real here; your statement is no more true than the ones you are calling out.

B

 

[g00fy]

Can we change the name of this thread to "FCA CP4 to CP3 Fan Fiction" ???

 

[Cseybert]

Fuel for the fire per say. Article too long to post. Sorry.

 

[Xflight29]

What I had ment by my ststement was no one knows what FCA will come up with as a fix untill we hear back from Ram Cares. This is called speculation about what will happen next. Somthing no one from here can answer.

 

[Epsilon Plus]

I get a kick out of the "why are you bitching, they're working on it" crowd.

They are working on it because we bitched.

If everyone took the no worry route nothing would be done. No "service solution" would be in the works. I bet all the CP4 white knights and people who say "just drive it!" and give the people seeking a solution crap, are some of the first inline if there was a recall. I can see you all now at the dealer in the waiting room talking to the old lady next to you, "yep, I told everyone FCA would recall. I knew there was a problem and we made them fix it!".

If there is a "service solution", when you go in for the fix, don't forget to holla at ya bois who got this thing rolling with our misplaced worries.

 

[NDanecker]

I get a kick out of the "why are you bitching, they're working on it" crowd.

They are working on it because we bitched.

If everyone took the no worry route nothing would be done. No "service solution" would be in the works. I bet all the CP4 white knights and people who say "just drive it!" and give the people seeking a solution crap, are some of the first inline if there was a recall. I can see you all now at the dealer in the waiting room talking to the old lady next to you, "yep, I told everyone FCA would recall. I knew there was a problem and we made them fix it!".

If there is a "service solution", when you go in for the fix, don't forget to holla at ya bois who got this thing rolling with our misplaced worries.

I'm amused that you feel a bunch of people on some forum board are the reasons why FCA will fix this issue. Its about dollars/profit not answering to the whim of a few forum board keyboard clickers. I don't think people realize forum board members represent a very small percent of vehicle owners.

Additionally it hasn't been fixed yet. Far I heard they are just replacing the CP4 with same pump. That's not a fix in my book. LOL Don't even know if a CP3 swap is even possible without changing many other parts and reprogramming PCM. Again - its about profit, and obviously the failure rate hasn't exceeded the warranty and tarnished reputation .... yet.

 

[Epsilon Plus]

You think its just this forum, huh? Nothing about it at all on TDR, CF, Comp Diesel?

No daily posts on FB groups like 5th Gen HD, 6.7 Cummins, 4th & 5th Gen...etc?

Yeah, just a few clickers here. 35k views in a few weeks, climbing to one of the most viewed threads in the multi year history of the site in just a few weeks but just a few clickers.

You're right. FCA totally made their only public address of the issue here because its just a few annoyinh clickers. Reputation is fully intact and means little to them. Issues with merit or not never spread big on the Internet.

 

[NDanecker]

Don't confuse chit-chat about a failure as an indication of a failure.

What is the true failure rate? Do we even know that, or are we all just jumping on a thread giving it more fuel than it deserves (no pun intended)?

 

[Xflight29]

Don't confuse chit-chat about a failure as an indication of a failure.

What is the true failure rate? Do we even know that, or are we all just jumping on a thread giving it more fuel than it deserves (no pun intended)?

That's all they are doing jumping on a form and constantly talking about the same thing over and over again and again.
I believe a fix is warranted. But will wait to see what Ram/Cummins come up with. I feel Cummins bragging rights on the high mileage club will be hurt if no fix is coming.

 

[ianacole]

If FCA didn't give two ****s about our thoughts, why is there representation from Ram Cares here?

 

[NDanecker]

That's all they are doing jumping on a form and constantly talking about the same thing over and over again and again.
I believe a fix is warranted. But will wait to see what Ram/Cummins come up with. I feel Cummins bragging rights on the high mileage club will be hurt if no fix is coming.

I agree. I don't understand why they feel the need to change things that work so well. Oh that's right. There is a HP/TQ war going on and we (buyers) are the ones that fuel it.

Different topic but this HP / TQ war is nuts. Don't get me wrong I'm fine with more but at some point it we need to pull back and put longevity above bragging rights. The majority of buyers don't need 1075 ft-lbs of TQ. We want it but don't really need it. 950 or 1000 will probably work. LOL. This unfortunately does not sell more trucks so FCA needs to play the balance between how long a truck will last and when it is considered 'old' or 'outdated' because the next gen makes X lb-ft more, and we just need to have it. Additionally, with how much TQ management these trucks have there is a small window to when we actually have all this torque on tap anyway.

I'm more worried about the switch to hydraulic lifters from solid. I never kept a diesel truck long enough to need valve lash adjustment (had 04, 13, 14 cummins). Read about a hotshotter I followed that had 280k miles or so without adjusting the lash and dropped the valve. Truck pulled either a 3, 4 or 5 car wedge all its life. Pulled motor apart and it was in excellent shape except for valve damage. If he would have done that maintenance it would not have blown up. Pretty sure it had the CP3 pump.

 

[NDanecker]

If FCA didn't give two ****s about our thoughts, why is there representation from Ram Cares here?

Because it makes people like you feel like they are listening (and care) suggesting to see a dealer with issue(s), but then deny legitimate CP4 claims stating fuel contamination. Honestly, how has RamCare helped other than say they are sorry you are having the issue and you should see a dealer? Isn't it common sense to see a dealer, or have people become that inept?

 

[ianacole]

Because it makes people like you feel like they are listening (and care) suggesting to see a dealer with issue(s), but then deny legitimate CP4 claims stating fuel contamination. Honestly, how has RamCare helped other than say they are sorry you are having the issue and you should see a dealer? Isn't it common sense to see a dealer, or have people become that inept?

Wow, there's a ton of assumption in there about what I care about. You do you, though.

 

[UglyViking]

I'm more worried about the switch to hydraulic lifters from solid. I never kept a diesel truck long enough to need valve lash adjustment (had 04, 13, 14 cummins). Read about a hotshotter I followed that had 280k miles or so without adjusting the lash and dropped the valve. Truck pulled either a 3, 4 or 5 car wedge all its life. Pulled motor apart and it was in excellent shape except for valve damage. If he would have done that maintenance it would not have blown up. Pretty sure it had the CP3 pump.

Why are you worried about this switch? Hydraulic lifters have been around forever and are nothing new. I think most (close to all?) engines use hydraulic lifters now a days don't they? As long as you're doing your maintenance you've got nothing to worry about.

 

[steve49]

The bottom line nobody really has any factual information other than there have been failures, and that RamCares recently says a fix is in the works. No lawsuits have produced any results yet with factual numbers from Ram, and I think I saw on here that the GM suit started in 2013 and hasn't been resolved yet. Nobody knows out of several hundred thousand 19-20 Ram trucks, how many have had failures in the US or Canada. Nobody knows how many failures were low or high mileage, real fuel contaminated, is it really a poor designed pump or poor quality US diesel fuel causing the failure? Everything has been speculation, opinion, he said she said, dealer said, Facebook said, after market vendor said, yet the only source that really knows is Cummins and Ram Trucks. Which may be the reasons the 21's have the CP3. We've seen a few posts here with low mileage failures, yet we have owners with high mileage trucks with no issues at all. So maybe my 19 pump with 7300 miles will fail, maybe not, but either way I'll drive it and not worry about it till such time I would have to deal with whatever part fails. When Ram has a fix then we'll all know there is a fix, and whether it'll be a recall with a CP3 or the large dimple CP4! If you weren't driving a Ram, you'd be dealing with another truck manufactures problems, so no matter what forum site you read, there will always be Gloom and Dome or the Sky is Falling!

 

[Epsilon Plus]

This forum, complaints, and the RamCares connection got the expensive and laborious A/C TSB from text to action.

Your local dealer probably doesn't know anything about it unless you showed them the paper.

A company in a ultra competitive market like this is interested in every facet of their public perception. You're naive to think outlets like these don't have impact.

It matters not, however. I believe it has impact and you don't. Neither of us is going to change position because of what we type. You can be sure that the issue won't go away because you are telling people Ram DGAF though.