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24 Hour Regens No Longer Happen

Will_T

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If you look at posts 143, 145, and 155 you can see my current status. Makes very little sense.

As noted in post 145, as per @AH64ID suggestion, I am watching for a possible regen at the 24-hour mark from the warranty appointment. Not there yet though.

I considered just posting this in the thread about the DPF where it was previously discussed. But this is really not about the DPF and is specific to my truck so I will put it here. For background, those post numbers above are for this thread: https://hdrams.com/forum/index.php?threads/diesel-particulate-filter-gauge-is-it-working.9971/page-8 But, it is not necessary to read that to understand what I am describing here. Anyway, here goes:

My truck regened exactly on the 24 hour mark for the first several times at 24, 48, 72, 96 and, I believe, 120 hours. At the 144 hour mark, it did not regen and I think that is when I posted in that other thread. The truck had been in for some warranty work before the 144 hour point at maybe 140 hours, so someone suggested maybe the dealer had flashed an update to the computer and that had started the 24 hour count over. They said that had happened to them and when I asked the dealer they said it was possible the tech updated the computer even though nothing was noted on the service record. He said they just do it as a matter of course if there is more recent software. I have been watching since then and the truck just today turned over to 169 hours. There has not been a regen since the last one at 120 hours. I know I have not missed it because I have had the EVIC on the DPF screen, (which has read zero for all this time). Plus I have a Banks iDash which is displaying the "Regen On/Off" pid and also 3 of the EGTs. I glance at that a lot when driving so combined with the EVIC, I know I have not missed the regens. For the 24 hour regens the truck did do, I saw the iDash switch that PID to "ON". Also saw the EGT temps climb dramatically. That has not happened since 120 hours.

If the truck was sticking to the original 24-hour count and not resetting in the case of a flash, there should have been regens at 144 and 168 hours. Even if the dealer did do a flash when it was in for service at about 140 hours and that reset the count, there still should have been a regen at 164 hours. I suppose that an update to the computer could have changed the way regens are done. Maybe now, with a later software version, the 24 hour regens don't happen when the DPF is being sensed as pretty much 0% soot? But I am not even sure the dealer has ever updated the software as they can't tell me and apparently do not note it in the service record as done unless the customer has specifically asked for it.

I am not too worried about the missing regens *IF* the EVIC is reading correctly as it has been sitting on zero for a long, long time. I also mainly tow our TT with the truck and that may keep the soot level down. Although of the current 169 hours, 50 of them are idle according to the EVIC. I am surprised with the truck thinking 1/3 of its hours are idling, the DPF gauge would always be at zero. Even still, it should be OK, I guess and I would be more worried if the DPF EVIC was showing a soot build up and 24-hour regens were not happening. But, it was sort of comforting to see the 24 hour regens happen even if they were not necessarily needed. There has not been a regen now for 49 engine hours. I know I have not missed them and would have expected two in that time. What do you all think could be going on?
 
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Jay P

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Do you have the DPF diff pressure and DPF percentage PIDs turned on on your iDash? If not I would turn them on. The diff should have a reading .1psi or higher and should go up as you request more power. The percentage PID should read something under 100%. Normal regen is at 100% if you have not gotten to the 24hrs.

Jay
 

Will_T

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I will have to look at the list of PIDs as I don't remember seeing those for the iDash. Do you have an iDash?

I do have the "PM1%" on and that is showing 0.0% whatever that means. Maybe it is reading the same thing as the EVIC gauge. I also have the "DPF RG %" on. I am not sure exactly what that shows although I do not think it has anything to do with soot level. I just thought of something though, MAYBE it is showing the % of time that has gone by before the next automatic, (24-hour), regen? I wonder that now because interestingly it is displaying 96%. So if I am correct in my guess the computer may be thinking it is getting close to time for a regen, regardless of soot level? I will watch that number and see what happens when it gets to 100%.
 

Will_T

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And I just looked at an updated iDash PID list from Banks for the 2021 6.7 (below). It actually looks like there are a few other Emissions PIDs that might help figure this out. A couple, like DPFDIS and DPFTIM seem like they are looking at historical data so that might be helpful. I will have to work on this tomorrow. I seem to remember that when I look on my actual iDash, I don't find all the PIDs that are listed here.


1680391366134.png
 

Jay P

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Be careful, the distance between regen and time between regen both reset when the ECU is flashed so they will read zero until an actual regen is completed. At this piont a manual regen may help. If you don't see diff press change I would suspect an issue with the diff pressure sensor. It's above the the DPF heat shield. The DPF is the middle piece in the exhaust. DOC is 1st, then DPF and last is SCR.

Jay
 

Jay P

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Also DPF soot percentages are calculated. The only true reading is the DPF diff pressure. The soot percentages are calculated based on diff pressure and some other actual measured values that the ECU reads.

Jay
 

Will_T

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Be careful, the distance between regen and time between regen both reset when the ECU is flashed so they will read zero until an actual regen is completed. At this piont a manual regen may help. If you don't see diff press change I would suspect an issue with the diff pressure sensor. It's above the the DPF heat shield. The DPF is the middle piece in the exhaust. DOC is 1st, then DPF and last is SCR.

Jay

Which of the PIDs in that list would you say gives the diff pressure change to monitor? Maybe "PMF M Monitor PM Filter"? That is in the diagnostics section though but unless I am blind, I don't see anything else in that list above that could be it. And do you think my guess on what the "DPF Regen Trigger%" is showing is correct?
 

Will_T

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Also DPF soot percentages are calculated. The only true reading is the DPF diff pressure. The soot percentages are calculated based on diff pressure and some other actual measured values that the ECU reads.

Jay

Hmm. So, if you were able to find a PID for the pressure difference, and it did not change, indicating a possible bad sensor, that could explain why, for some people, their DPF EVIC is all over the place or even always on zero?
 

Jay P

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Which of the PIDs in that list would you say gives the diff pressure change to monitor? Maybe "PMF M Monitor PM Filter"? That is in the diagnostics section though but unless I am blind, I don't see anything else in that list above that could be it. And do you think my guess on what the "DPF Regen Trigger%" is showing is correct?
See pic It's under pressure (not emissions) in the iDash.
 

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Jay P

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Hmm. So, if you were able to find a PID for the pressure difference, and it did not change, indicating a possible bad sensor, that could explain why, for some people, their DPF EVIC is all over the place or even always on zero?
Maybe, but if it's at zero either a ECU flash has been done or it's been reset using the mopar computer tools (whatever they call it) or AlfaOBD/JScan or any other tool that allows you to reset because the DPF was replaced.
 

Will_T

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Maybe, but if it's at zero either a ECU flash has been done or it's been reset using the mopar computer tools (whatever they call it) or AlfaOBD/JScan.
Mine, and many other people's has been at zero for probably 95+ percent of the time since truck was new.
 

Jay P

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Mine, and many other people's has been at zero for probably 95+ percent of the time since truck was new.
I quit looking at those PIDs because mine never showed good numbers. Distance seems to work for the most part but hours has never been right. Maybe this is a Banks issue reading it from the ECU.
 

Will_T

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I quit looking at those PIDs because mine never showed good numbers. Distance seems to work for the most part but hours has never been right. Maybe this is a Banks issue reading it from the ECU.
Maybe, but the EVIC shows the same thing.
 

Will_T

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See pic It's under pressure (not emissions) in the iDash.
Thanks. I found it on the list, "DPF Outlet Pressure Bank 1". Tomorrow I will see if that PID is actually in my iDash. As I noted, I previously found a couple on the list that were not available on my iDash.
 

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Thanks. I found it on the list, "DPF Outlet Pressure Bank 1". Tomorrow I will see if that PID is actually in my iDash. As I noted, I previously found a couple on the list that were not available on my iDash.
It's the delta pressure, not the outlet pressure (DPFDP1). As for finding it on your iDash, make sure the firmware is up to date and look under look under different categories (I have found ones you think should be emissions but is under temp or pressure only).

Jay
 

waveslayer

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Hmm. So, if you were able to find a PID for the pressure difference, and it did not change, indicating a possible bad sensor, that could explain why, for some people, their DPF EVIC is all over the place or even always on zero?
I have been watching my DPF gauge on my truck and iDash. My gauge has always read 0. Yesterday it finally registered, the dpf gauge on the truck, when the iDash said the dpf was at 70%. I'm at 75% as of yesterday and the truck's dpf gauge hasn't moved but registers a little bit... I'm watching it and will report back.

So does the truck's gauge not indicate the dpf level until 70% full and above?

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AH64ID

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I have been watching my DPF gauge on my truck and iDash. My gauge has always read 0. Yesterday it finally registered, the dpf gauge on the truck, when the iDash said the dpf was at 70%. I'm at 75% as of yesterday and the truck's dpf gauge hasn't moved but registers a little bit... I'm watching it and will report back.

So does the truck's gauge not indicate the dpf level until 70% full and above?

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

The percentage reported thru the PID also takes hours into account, so it can go to 100% after 24 hours but never register on the EVIC. At that point you get a regen.
 

Jay P

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I have been watching my DPF gauge on my truck and iDash. My gauge has always read 0. Yesterday it finally registered, the dpf gauge on the truck, when the iDash said the dpf was at 70%. I'm at 75% as of yesterday and the truck's dpf gauge hasn't moved but registers a little bit... I'm watching it and will report back.

So does the truck's gauge not indicate the dpf level until 70% full and above?

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk
I think the PID shown on the EVIC is there from customer pressure. It doesn't work right and RAM should just get rid of it. The one you see on iDash or Edge display is far more accurate.
 

AH64ID

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I think the PID shown on the EVIC is there from customer pressure. It doesn't work right and RAM should just get rid of it. The one you see on iDash or Edge display is far more accurate.

Why do you think it doesn’t work right?

The percentage thru OBD is a different thing than the gauge.
 

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