Thuren King 2.5 vs Carli Pintop/Backcountry

[AEV_CUMMINS]

I have an 21' 2500 CTD just placed on order and found out either company has 12+ week wait times for suspension systems. So the time to buy for me is now. If I were to get Carli it would be - 3.25'' full system with Torsion sway bar and if I got Thuren I would get 2.75'' Front coil & 1'' rear coil full kit with Thuren active rate sway Bar.
I was 100% sold on Carli Backcountry after watching many videos and reviews that Backcountry system is softer overall than the Pintop and that the Pintop requires more speed to push through valving. However after reading and looking into Thuren.. I notice that the King 2.5 system is not only less expensive than the Pintop (Carli equivalent) but with the customization that Thuren does with there orders.. like asking for specific client wants/needs on valving.. I think I would get a better ride and more fine tuned system for my use case. My use case - Daily driving (I drive a little more aggressively than your average commuter), hunting, fishing & rutted out back roads on weekends. AEV front bumper and planning to get into the overland camping scene somewhat. 17'' or 18'' wheels w/37'' tires. I put comfort, ride quality and driving dynamics at the top of my list.
I am leaning towards Thuren for the reasons of the customization of valving (Stage 2 I think), front & rear track bars for added control (Carli does not have a rear bar), custom King 2.5's less expensive than Carli and last but not least I estimate getting the parts will be far easier as Carli is having many retailers stop taking orders as they are so backlogged. The reason I would go Carli is legendary reputation, awesome content created on Youtube and set systems like Backcountry already setup the way ''experts'' created it so would take out the decision process of customizing and just go with something that is proven (kind of like having 1 perfect drive mode instead of a mode for every day of the week.. *cough* Ford *cough*). Also I live in B.C Canada and would love to hear shop recommendations for either system. Please let me know opinions on my situation and or what you would or have went for in your situation. If you think my use case should be comparing Pintop to Thuren King 2.5 also tell me if I am wrong thinking Backcountry for my use. Thanks!

 

[Rockcrawlindude]

can’t really go wrong with either if comfort and ride quality are at the top of your needs list.

In for pics of finished rig

As for a shop, install it yourself. Easy peasy and you’ll know your way around the rig once you’re done.

 

[AEV_CUMMINS]

I read on anther forum that 2.5'' shocks are inherently stiffer than 2.0''. I am thinking with Thuren being as they are custom valving that I can have it the same if not better? Could the Thuren 2.5 King's in theory be softer riding than Carli Backcountry 2.0 resi's given the valving? Not looking for jello compression but just posing the question as my thoughts are the 2.5 primarily just adds more oil and larger valving to make more fine tuned adjustments?

 

[AEV_CUMMINS]

can’t really go wrong with either if comfort and ride quality are at the top of your needs list.

In for pics of finished rig

As for a shop, install it yourself. Easy peasy and you’ll know your way around the rig once you’re done.

I will post pictures as soon as this all comes together. As for installation.. I refrain from doing it myself as I not only do not have a lift capable of this much clearance but also with either of these systems being around $7000.00 CDN, I want to ensure when I finally do drive on the setup that I have no doubts that it is on and riding to the full potential of the kit and cannot blame myself . Plus with the alignment and wheels & tires that will be needing mounting at the same time.

 

[Rockcrawlindude]

I read on anther forum that 2.5'' shocks are inherently stiffer than 2.0''. I am thinking with Thuren being as they are custom valving that I can have it the same if not better? Could the Thuren 2.5 King's in theory be softer riding than Carli Backcountry 2.0 resi's given the valving? Not looking for jello compression but just posing the question as my thoughts are the 2.5 primarily just adds more oil and larger valving to make more fine tuned adjustments?

That is correct. The reason is because you have an Internal floating piston and nitrogen on the other side of this piston. The nitrogen is charged to 200psi. A 2.5” piston has more surface area than a 2” piston, more square inches. (PSI = pounds per square inch) The gas pressure and valving being equal, the 2.5” piston will require more force to be compressed than the 2” piston. 2” body shocks have a 5/8” shaft and 2.5” shocks have a 7/8” shaft. The shafts take up volume in the shock body when the shock is compressed, the gas pressure will try to push them back out.

that being said, you can valve shocks to your liking. (You can play with gas pressure a bit but be careful of cavitation) I run 2.5” remote resis on the rear of my rock crawler and it’s a light rig. But, I pulled the pistons out of the shocks and drilled bleed ports in them and I also changed out the valve shim stacks from a stack of .010” shims to a stack of .008” shims. They’re super light and smooth now.

 

[yorken99]

I am in exactly the same situation. I also have a '21 (2500 MegaCab). I looked around for weeks and changed my mind so many times - and ended up ordering the Thuren system (last week) - for several reasons:
1. As you said, Thuren tunes the King 2.5 shocks to your specific uses. I'm 90% street driving with ~15 snowmobile trips per year (sled deck with 2 sleds), haul an 8k lb boat 10x per year, and haul heavy loads (i.e. landscape rock) ~10x per year. I ended up with the Level 2. That was my calculation, and Chris at Thuren agreed 100%.
2. Cost - $4,750 vs $7K - Carli wants you to get the re-enforced radius arms and drop brackets. Both from talking to friends, and on forums, the stock Radius arms are pretty beefy. Thuren mentioned to me that they had never seen a broken stock radius arm, but they have seen broken aftermarket radius arms
3. I also like getting the front and rear track bar.
4. 1 piece sway bar vs torsen sway bar - to be fair, I could have ordered the Carli system and the Thuren sway bar, but for reasons 1 & 2 above, I decided to go with the Thuren system. And I like Thuren's single piece sway bar. The Carli torsion sway bar is interesting, but my quick conclusion is that with a torsion linkage in the middle, it's one more thing that can break. And although I don't go offroad too often, when I do, I beat the crap out of my truck. Last point: apparently the Carli sway bar doesn't fit with the OEM wheels - which I am considering running in the winter with Blizzak snow tires.
5. More local and available - I grew up in Oregon - and while I live in Washington state now, I like the idea of being close to the manufacturer. In addition, Don Thuren and the team seem to me to really care about their customers and what we are trying to do with our trucks. They specifically have an interchange with every customer ordering their system to ensure they understand how you intend to use your truck. I have no hard evidence, but I believe if I have some weird issue, I'm much more likely to get the Thuren team to help me out than the Carli team.

I have no commercial relationship with any aftermarket parts company. I am just detailing my thought process and why I chose to go this route with my Ram 2500 aftermarket suspension.

Side note: I want some overload protection, given the heavy loads and trailering I do occasionally. I had somewhat settled on the Timbren springs to do the job (possibly with some custom brackets to account for the longer suspension travel). FWIW: Thuren mentioned they are looking to come out with their own rubber overload spring -that will work with their suspension systems. Food for thought....

Best of luck. There is no right answer IMO..... both systems look great.

 

[Brewbud]

Both are great options. Both companies spend a lot of time on R&D. Both have great customer service. If you go Thuren you should upgrade the shafts to stainless steel if your trucks sees winter conditions. Carli is already spec'ed with SS shafts and their custom piston. Many run the Carli kits with the stock radius arms. Carli does have the radius arm drops which help with suspension cycle with lifts at 3" and up. It is nice that Thuren allows you to pick the valving you want to run.

 

[AEV_CUMMINS]

I am in exactly the same situation. I also have a '21 (2500 MegaCab). I looked around for weeks and changed my mind so many times - and ended up ordering the Thuren system (last week) - for several reasons:
1. As you said, Thuren tunes the King 2.5 shocks to your specific uses. I'm 90% street driving with ~15 snowmobile trips per year (sled deck with 2 sleds), haul an 8k lb boat 10x per year, and haul heavy loads (i.e. landscape rock) ~10x per year. I ended up with the Level 2. That was my calculation, and Chris at Thuren agreed 100%.
2. Cost - $4,750 vs $7K - Carli wants you to get the re-enforced radius arms and drop brackets. Both from talking to friends, and on forums, the stock Radius arms are pretty beefy. Thuren mentioned to me that they had never seen a broken stock radius arm, but they have seen broken aftermarket radius arms
3. I also like getting the front and rear track bar.
4. 1 piece sway bar vs torsen sway bar - to be fair, I could have ordered the Carli system and the Thuren sway bar, but for reasons 1 & 2 above, I decided to go with the Thuren system. And I like Thuren's single piece sway bar. The Carli torsion sway bar is interesting, but my quick conclusion is that with a torsion linkage in the middle, it's one more thing that can break. And although I don't go offroad too often, when I do, I beat the crap out of my truck. Last point: apparently the Carli sway bar doesn't fit with the OEM wheels - which I am considering running in the winter with Blizzak snow tires.
5. More local and available - I grew up in Oregon - and while I live in Washington state now, I like the idea of being close to the manufacturer. In addition, Don Thuren and the team seem to me to really care about their customers and what we are trying to do with our trucks. They specifically have an interchange with every customer ordering their system to ensure they understand how you intend to use your truck. I have no hard evidence, but I believe if I have some weird issue, I'm much more likely to get the Thuren team to help me out than the Carli team.

I have no commercial relationship with any aftermarket parts company. I am just detailing my thought process and why I chose to go this route with my Ram 2500 aftermarket suspension.

Side note: I want some overload protection, given the heavy loads and trailering I do occasionally. I had somewhat settled on the Timbren springs to do the job (possibly with some custom brackets to account for the longer suspension travel). FWIW: Thuren mentioned they are looking to come out with their own rubber overload spring -that will work with their suspension systems. Food for thought....

Best of luck. There is no right answer IMO..... both systems look great.

Thank you for your feedback. I am about to place my order from Thuren and just have a couple questions left.. Did you order the bump stops front & rear from Thuren? I heard from them that they are coming out with new ones very soon and that it is not a must have option but is great to have and especially if you go fast off road. Also, did you go with the short body rear shocks?

 

[yorken99]

They don't offer the short body rear shocks anymore - according to Chris at Thuren. They were 'at the edge of their engineering envelop' (guessing that's code for too many people broke them).

I didn't order the bump stops both for the reasons you mention, and for the rear I plan to use the Timbren overload springs in place of the bump stops (or the new Thuren rubber overload springs if they come out in time and I like what I see). If I was doing high-speed off-road often, I would probably get the bump stops for the front and maybe even some limit straps. I guess if I end up breaking a shock, the bump stops will become a higher priority.

I highly encourage you to call them to talk through your situation and expected usage. Call Carli too - can't hurt to hear what they have to say.

 

[AEV_CUMMINS]

They don't offer the short body rear shocks anymore - according to Chris at Thuren. They were 'at the edge of their engineering envelop' (guessing that's code for too many people broke them).

I didn't order the bump stops both for the reasons you mention, and for the rear I plan to use the Timbren overload springs in place of the bump stops (or the new Thuren rubber overload springs if they come out in time and I like what I see). If I was doing high-speed off-road often, I would probably get the bump stops for the front and maybe even some limit straps. I guess if I end up breaking a shock, the bump stops will become a higher priority.

I highly encourage you to call them to talk through your situation and expected usage. Call Carli too - can't hurt to hear what they have to say.

Thanks. Good idea... I will do. In email communication with Chris already at Thuren but I have almost completely written Carli off at this point as idk what is true about wait times anymore from them. Plus they lift the front over 3'' and 1'' rear. Thuren does 2.75'' front & 1' rear as well. Makes me think that Thuren will have a better look for my truck and not have such a nose high feel.. although small difference I know.

 

[Dave88LX]

I've bought lifts from both Thuren (2007 Ram 2500) and Carli (2016 Jeep Wrangler JKU) in the past. I felt that the quality of materials and design were excellent in both systems. I also thought both companies had great communication with me. I really don't think you can go wrong with either company. It might just come down to who throws more stickers in the box!

If you are on FB, you can check out Carli Suspension Owner's Group and get read/post to get some more feed back from Carli customers, other dealers, and some of the Carli guys themselves. Thuren also has a group...I forget what it is called. Clayton from DDP is on there frequently.

 

[AEV_CUMMINS]

Update: I placed an order for Carli 3.25'' Backcountry system w/Torsen Sway Bar. After more photos, research, shop support and availability near me I chose to stick with my gut and go Carli. I felt like I was trying to find reasons to go with Thuren over Carli when Carli is what gets me excited every time I look into it. The fact that Thuren is max 2.75 in front (wouldnt even be that much on my Megacab) and Carli is 3.25.. I felt from seeing pictures and videos that I would be happier in the long run with the Carli system. Also as I mentioned above.. Carli has they're expert tune on the shocks and leaves the guess work out of it for me (not that Thuren would not do the same). I am so looking forward to the arrival and I think it will pair perfect with my AEV setup! Thank you all for your comments and suggestions.. I will post pictures and update as my order arrives and I get some seat time!

 

[Rockcrawlindude]

Update: I placed an order for Carli 3.25'' Backcountry system w/Torsen Sway Bar. After more photos, research, shop support and availability near me I chose to stick with my gut and go Carli. I felt like I was trying to find reasons to go with Thuren over Carli when Carli is what gets me excited every time I look into it. The fact that Thuren is max 2.75 in front (wouldnt even be that much on my Megacab) and Carli is 3.25.. I felt from seeing pictures and videos that I would be happier in the long run with the Carli system. Also as I mentioned above.. Carli has they're expert tune on the shocks and leaves the guess work out of it for me (not that Thuren would not do the same). I am so looking forward to the arrival and I think it will pair perfect with my AEV setup! Thank you all for your comments and suggestions.. I will post pictures and update as my order arrives and I get some seat time!

Are you removing your AEV lift in favor of the new kit? Or are you just swapping the bilstein out for the carli shocks and adding carli swaybar ?

 

[AEV_CUMMINS]

Are you removing your AEV lift in favor of the new kit? Or are you just swapping the bilstein out for the carli shocks and adding carli swaybar ?

I bought the AEV stuff piece by piece. I did not get the dualsport from them. I purposely did not go the full AEV purchase as I knew I was going to customize a few parts over only sticking with AEV.

 

[Dave88LX]

Congrats! It's a tough choice! But either choice is the right one so don't sweat it.
Who did you order through, and what did they say the lead time was?

 

[AEV_CUMMINS]

Congrats! It's a tough choice! But either choice is the right one so don't sweat it.
Who did you order through, and what did they say the lead time was?

I ordered through BAJA NORTH in Kamloops. They are listed on Carli's website as a ''stocking dealer'' in a upper category included with a select few like CJC Off Road. I called a couple dealers that were listed but as non-stocking or regular dealers and they had told me over 1 year wait. BAJA North secured me a 20 week or so commitment. Not sure if being in the different category of dealer has any part to play but I am glad I got it ordered!

 

[19laramiehd]

Im a bit late. I have a 2019 2500 megacab 6.4
I have every piece from thuren that can go on front to rear. I started off with a level kit. Front sway bar and 2.0 kings with front coils. Stock coils with king 2.0 in the rear. At 20k miles i upgraded front and rear trackbar. Rear end links.

I just received my king 2.5 with their new medium rate stock height coils. Expect more than 12 weeks. Will install tomorrow.

Thuren has been great. I mostly drive freeway and commute everyday. Wanted a bit more comfort for the rear. In bad areas it can get bouncy with no load.

 

[Smittys2500RAM]

Update: I placed an order for Carli 3.25'' Backcountry system w/Torsen Sway Bar. After more photos, research, shop support and availability near me I chose to stick with my gut and go Carli. I felt like I was trying to find reasons to go with Thuren over Carli when Carli is what gets me excited every time I look into it. The fact that Thuren is max 2.75 in front (wouldnt even be that much on my Megacab) and Carli is 3.25.. I felt from seeing pictures and videos that I would be happier in the long run with the Carli system. Also as I mentioned above.. Carli has they're expert tune on the shocks and leaves the guess work out of it for me (not that Thuren would not do the same). I am so looking forward to the arrival and I think it will pair perfect with my AEV setup! Thank you all for your comments and suggestions.. I will post pictures and update as my order arrives and I get some seat time!

Its been a minute, any pictures and updates? Im in the exact same boat on what to go with. Do I want the 2.75 from Thuren or the 3.25 from Carli????

 

[BoatieTX]

I installed Cali 3.25" Pintop, add-a-packs, Thuren active rate sway bar. Building a house for a customer 18 miles off highway. I couldn't be more impressed with my choice. 200 mile roundtrip. 2500 miles on it so far. Wild improvement.

 

[Smittys2500RAM]

I went with Thuren. Got the 2.75” front and 1” soft ride springs coupled with their stage 2 King 2.5 shocks. Got both front and rear track bars and the sway bar. The ride is insanely improved! When you get up close and personal with this product, there are no regrets!!! This stuff is solid! Now I need new wheels and tires!!!