CP4 to CP-ISB21S3 (revised CP3) change for 2021 6.7L Diesel Trucks -- Merged Threads

[Wmhjr]

Been watching this for a while. I fully grasped that it is unlikely that the '20 cp4 will go kaboom. However, our situation is that we often pull horses, long distances, and through some very isolated areas as well as across interstates. It's one thing to have to get recovered with an RV or car hauler. It's something totally different to be stranded on the side of a highway with a few 1000lb+ horses. They don't fit in Ubers or motels very well. Had a US Riders roadside plan, but it was worthless. Bought the '20 to replace the '04 with 320k on it just for added piece of mind. So, after watching and waiting we finally went and talked to the dealer, and made a deal to swap the '20 Bighorn for a '21 Laramie. They treated us OK, and we pretty much got what we paid for the Bighorn back - however not much in the way of incentives on the '21. Nothing is perfect and there is no guarantee but we're keeping our fingers crossed. Turning in the '20 and picking up the '21 tomorrow evening. I'll be watching to see how things progress on this and hope that FCA makes things right for the '19-20 owners.

 

[UglyViking]

The thing I find strange with all of this is the fact that they didn't announce a recall when they released the '21s with the CP3. It seemed like a perfect opportunity to not only make things right within the community but also set itself apart from the other two. They updated the CP3 silently, but it seems they would have been better served by being more public about it. A sort of "with the introduction of the 2021 ram HD series trucks we have made a change to the fuel system by replacing the CP4 with an updated CP3. We listened to the community as well as what we were seeing from our dealers and just weren't happy with the performance of the CP4. Starting today all new Cummins equipped rams will have a new CP3 fuel pump and for all owners of 19-20 MY trucks equipped with a CP4 we will be updating to a CP3 free of charge."

Something like that would have absolutely blown Ford/GM away since all 3 had similar issues. FCA would have been well ahead of the game and likely would have built a reputation that kept customers for life. I wonder how many owners left Ram for Ford/GM due to failures or because they were scared of failures? Seems like a huge missed opportunity for whatever small cost they may have to pay back certain owners. As it stands they are sort of silently "doing the right thing" vs being more up front and public about it. With the way social media and such works today there are very few, if any, non-public failures this widespread. Why not double down and use whatever loss as an opportunity?

Either way, if the word on the street is July I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

 

[leeroy300]

yup l sold my Ram and won’t be back. such uncertainty in your truck dosen’t promote any level of confidence when you are miles from home! To bad was a beautiful truck.

 

[alangley]

The thing I find strange with all of this is the fact that they didn't announce a recall when they released the '21s with the CP3. It seemed like a perfect opportunity to not only make things right within the community but also set itself apart from the other two. They updated the CP3 silently, but it seems they would have been better served by being more public about it. A sort of "with the introduction of the 2021 ram HD series trucks we have made a change to the fuel system by replacing the CP4 with an updated CP3. We listened to the community as well as what we were seeing from our dealers and just weren't happy with the performance of the CP4. Starting today all new Cummins equipped rams will have a new CP3 fuel pump and for all owners of 19-20 MY trucks equipped with a CP4 we will be updating to a CP3 free of charge."

Something like that would have absolutely blown Ford/GM away since all 3 had similar issues. FCA would have been well ahead of the game and likely would have built a reputation that kept customers for life. I wonder how many owners left Ram for Ford/GM due to failures or because they were scared of failures? Seems like a huge missed opportunity for whatever small cost they may have to pay back certain owners. As it stands they are sort of silently "doing the right thing" vs being more up front and public about it. With the way social media and such works today there are very few, if any, non-public failures this widespread. Why not double down and use whatever loss as an opportunity?

Either way, if the word on the street is July I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

Could not have been said better, but there is still time to make it right @RamCares

 

[mra400ex]

yup l sold my Ram and won’t be back. such uncertainty in your truck dosen’t promote any level of confidence when you are miles from home! To bad was a beautiful truck.

I heat you loud and clear. I miss my 2020 Ram but my replacement with gas motor will get the job done.

 

[leeroy300]

l feel as a previous 2014 Ram owner and going to a 2020 l would have gotten at least as reliable major components and NOT something that was already proven by the other companies not be be up to Ram durability that we were mislead so they would save a few $$

 

[Wmhjr]

l feel as a previous 2014 Ram owner and going to a 2020 l would have gotten at least as reliable major components and NOT something that was already proven by the other companies not be be up to Ram durability that we were mislead so they would save a few $$

That was my thought. The Cummins is the one and only reason I had the '04, and it's the only reason we got the '20. I always joked with people that my '04 was an awesome drivetrain surrounded by a POS. But that awesome drivetrain made it all worth it. With the '20, I had the cab leaking rain into it like crazy, the cruise control switch went bad (all within 30 days of purchase), and the turbo speed sensor failing at less than 4k miles. If it were not for the CP4, I'd just have thought 'there they go again" but at least I have confidence in reliability. But the CP4 killed that. Not just because of the reliability concerns, but because FCA has IMHO demonstrated that they aren't rock solid in standing behind their mistake (FCA making claims of bad fuel, trying to avoid warranty, taking 3 months for repair, not providing suitable temporary replacement, etc). The only reason I traded up to the '21 was because it would have cost too much to consider trading out to a Duramax. Only bought the '20 in October - and the dealer worked with us. The next time I buy a truck, it won't be like this time. I'll be looking MUCH harder at the other choices. Replacing the Bighorn with a Laramie - only because choices were limited. So, lots more money - though I admit I will enjoy a few of the features. But it's really about not having to worry about getting stuck in the middle of nowhere with the horses. I shouldn't have to pay a ton of money to get confidence in a $65k+ vehicle that is only 6 months old.

 

[gimmie11s]

yup l sold my Ram and won’t be back. such uncertainty in your truck dosen’t promote any level of confidence when you are miles from home! To bad was a beautiful truck.

You dumped a $70k+ truck that is easily the nicest current offering of the Big 3 in the HD truck segment over a part that would cost you $2300 to fix/upgrade? Why?

The pump is a problem in 19/20s, yes, but if i was a 19/20 owner, i'd buy a cp3 retro kit and be done with it. Should you have to? Nope... but with what GM and Ford is offering, the HD Ram is faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar superior in every way and especially where you spend MOST of your time (the interior!!).

The Ford interior is hard plastic trash and the GM offerings look like they came out of a 4th grade session of brainstorming.

 

[Wmhjr]

You dumped a $70k+ truck that is easily the nicest current offering of the Big 3 in the HD truck segment over a part that would cost you $2300 to fix/upgrade? Why?

The pump is a problem in 19/20s, yes, but if i was a 19/20 owner, i'd buy a cp3 retro kit and be done with it. Should you have to? Nope... but with what GM and Ford is offering, the HD Ram is faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar superior in every way and especially where you spend MOST of your time (the interior!!).

The Ford interior is hard plastic trash and the GM offerings look like they came out of a 4th grade session of brainstorming.

Your opinion is not founded on all the facts.. If you buy a retro kit you also kill your warranty. That's a BIG deal.

 

[gimmie11s]

Your opinion is not founded on all the facts.. If you buy a retro kit you also kill your warranty. That's a BIG deal.

Fair enough and i understand that is a concern. That said, how many owners can you find that have had the motor lock up? .... almost 0.

Other than the fuel pump, these trucks are ROCK solid, look great, and the interior is second to NO ONE. My opinion is the gamble is worth the entry fee. But your mileage may vary.,

To each his own!

 

[leeroy300]

wanting to avoid warrenty because of poor quality fuel- just because its dyed (same fuel we run in $$5,000 ,000 cranes ) also same fuel from the same tank at the local refineary- trucker adds dye after he pumps it out. give me a break thats not standing by your product! and to replace the products should it fail here in Canada is $10,000 not to mention always wondering on each road trip is this the day!
You are 100% right these trucks excell in interior quality but for durability its hard to top Ford any way my truck my choice

 

[gimmie11s]

wanting to avoid warrenty because of poor quality fuel- just because its dyed (same fuel we run in $$5,000 ,000 cranes ) also same fuel from the same tank at the local refineary- trucker adds dye after he pumps it out. give me a break thats not standing by your product! and to replace the products should it fail here in Canada is $10,000 not to mention always wondering on each road trip is this the day!
You are 100% right these trucks excell in interior quality but for durability its hard to top Ford any way my truck my choice

Ford is still using the CP4..........

 

[leeroy300]

Ford is still using the CP4..........

but its not overclocked!

 

[leeroy300]

but its not overclocked!

and if you go Ford you know what to expect at least they repair it regargless of colour of fuel

 

[leeroy300]

and if you go Ford you know what to expect at least they repair it regargless of colour of fuel

btw we still kept the 5th gen Ram 1/2 ton sport because of interior quality

 

[gimmie11s]

but its not overclocked!

True but a 5 minute cruise over the Superduty forums shows plenty of pissed off Ford owners with metal flakes in their fuel systems.

The prob with the cp4 is inherent in it's design with how the follower can spin on the cam. There was a good video explaining/showing the issues a few pages back.

I hope you have better luck with your Powerstroke. They have a TON of power, that's for sure. No one else is close.

 

[leeroy300]

and not to dwell but no one will divulge comparisons between units sold and failure rates so a guy has to decide which company will take care of the failure with the least amount of hassle Cheers

 

[Wmhjr]

Fair enough and i understand that is a concern. That said, how many owners can you find that have had the motor lock up? .... almost 0.

Other than the fuel pump, these trucks are ROCK solid, look great, and the interior is second to NO ONE. My opinion is the gamble is worth the entry fee. But your mileage may vary.,

To each his own!

Obviously, every use case is different. Try pulling a gooseneck horse trailer loaded with horses halfway across the country and get immediately stranded because the CP4 fails. You'll sing a different tune then. I tried US Riders roadside equestrian service. They completely failed. So, let's assume you're on an isolated stretch of highway with little cell coverage, very little berm, it's 95 degrees out plus the sun..... What do you do then?

And yes, I know personally of two owners in my area that had their CP4 go.

If you want to paint it as a gamble, everyone has a different hand of cards. Like I said, if I were only pulling my (non-horse related) race trailer, my bumper pull RV trailer, my dump trailer, or flatbed - I would not be nearly as concerned. As for the interiors, I agree that the RAM looks the nicest. However, my experience is that it doesn't hold up quite as well, but that's just my opinion. A lot of that is subjective. That being said, I got my truck for RELIABLE PULLING. Not for the interior.

 

[gimmie11s]

Obviously, every use case is different. Try pulling a gooseneck horse trailer loaded with horses halfway across the country and get immediately stranded because the CP4 fails. You'll sing a different tune then. I tried US Riders roadside equestrian service. They completely failed. So, let's assume you're on an isolated stretch of highway with little cell coverage, very little berm, it's 95 degrees out plus the sun..... What do you do then?

And yes, I know personally of two owners in my area that had their CP4 go.

If you want to paint it as a gamble, everyone has a different hand of cards. Like I said, if I were only pulling my (non-horse related) race trailer, my bumper pull RV trailer, my dump trailer, or flatbed - I would not be nearly as concerned. As for the interiors, I agree that the RAM looks the nicest. However, my experience is that it doesn't hold up quite as well, but that's just my opinion. A lot of that is subjective. That being said, I got my truck for RELIABLE PULLING. Not for the interior.

Go back and re-read my posts... I am not advocating for any CP4. It is trash.

I am advocating for a CP3 retro on a CP4 truck because the rest of the truck is head and shoulders above Ford and GM.

Heres a hint... the other brands are still using the CP4, so what are your options?

 

[mra400ex]

Ford is still using the CP4..........

It is not overclocked and a $300 kit takes car of glitter if it fails. Not that they are in the same denial on the CP4