Correct shocks for 3500 dually rear air auto leveling

[kingdaddy]

I posted this request for info on a reply to another thread but thought I should start my own thread here...
I am trying to find the correct part number for Bilstein shocks (either 4600 or 5100) front and rear. The problem is making sure the rear shocks are the right ones since my truck (see sig) has rear auto air leveling.
The 4600s I found "seemed" to be correct, but there is a disclaimer for the rear shocks (part (24-238533) on the Bilstein website saying "without air leveling suspension".
I measured the rear shocks from center of mounting eyelet top to bottom right at 23" as the truck sits empty. There is always some amount of air in the bags since it is part of the normal suspension operation, not just for supporting heavy loads.
The length of the Bilsteins seem to be right as far as overall length, but for some reason they are saying they won't work, no explanation as to why?
Anybody deal with this and find a solution i.e. the correct part number? Appreciate any feedback...Thanks,

 

[Brutal_HO]

Someone will jump in, but we do prefer that you don't cross post in multiple forums/threads as it's confusing to respondents.

I can't help with certainly as I only know what fits my 3500 SRW but don't know the same holds true for the dually (though it should).

They say the fronts don't fit as they're listed for a lift, but the compressed length is only ~1/4-3/8 different form the 4600 factory equivalent shock.

Rears: 5100 24-302326 https://www.shocksurplus.com/produc...e-shocks-rear-pair-for-2013-2022-ram-3500-4wd
Fronts: 5100 24-251747 https://www.shocksurplus.com/produc...18-ram-3500-2wd-4wd-w-2-2-5-lift#part-numbers

part numbers for the rears have changed a few times so that complicates research a bit.

 

[AH64ID]

Bilstien only advertises a 4600 for the rear of the auto-level trucks for 19+. No rear shocks for 15-18 auto-level. They don’t differentiate between SRW and DRW.

Product Details

 

[kingdaddy]

Thanks for the help and feedback...I checked the links to shocksurplus (which is where I've been looking) and the rear shocks detail has this disclaimer :
"Important Fit Note: Without Air Leveling Suspension"
Again...NO explanation as to WHY? Apart from the length (compressed and extended) the only reason I can figure is the spring rate for the rear air leveling trucks is different enough to require a different shock. Would be nice for Bilstein to offer a reason for this, but they don't. Hard to imagine there would be that much difference... still researching.

 

[kingdaddy]

I looked at those 4600s (which is my first choice anyway) and they DO specifically indicate that this shock works for rear air leveling trucks:
"Notes: -With Rear Air Leveling Suspension" HOWEVER it also notes that it is for model year 2019-23. Mine is a 2015. No idea what the changes would be that might make this incompatible with my truck as compared to a '19-23?

 

[gimmie11s]

I have 5100's on my air-ride DRW. Below is the part number. My truck is lifted 2" in the rear but the shocks are listed as being compatible with stock height trucks.

 

[kingdaddy]

Thanks for that info! Interesting...so you went with these shocks even though they are listed as for 0-1" lift and you have 2"? Also they specify "without rear air assist leveling" which is why I'm glad you posted since it is obviously working out fine for you!
I'm gonna assume your rear suspension is essentially the same as mine even though your truck is 6 years newer... Wondering why Bilstein says they are not compatible with rear air suspension? Yeah, it would be nice to be able to just call tech support at Bilstein! Good luck with that...

 

[gimmie11s]

Thanks for that info! Interesting...so you went with these shocks even though they are listed as for 0-1" lift and you have 2"? Also they specify "without rear air assist leveling" which is why I'm glad you posted since it is obviously working out fine for you!
I'm gonna assume your rear suspension is essentially the same as mine even though your truck is 6 years newer... Wondering why Bilstein says they are not compatible with rear air suspension? Yeah, it would be nice to be able to just call tech support at Bilstein! Good luck with that...

I will get a wider angle view picture of underneath the rear end of the truck so you can see if yours matches up to mine.

 

[kingdaddy]

Great! Thanks again....BTW what is the model number for the front 5100s that you used?

 

[gimmie11s]

Great! Thanks again....BTW what is the model number for the front 5100s that you used?

5100 is the model. Part number is in the clip above I posted.

 

[kingdaddy]

Yeah, I know 5100 is the model, but the part number you listed is for rears only...did you use 5100s for the front also?
Thanks,

 

[gimmie11s]

Ah man, im sorry. I didn't see the "fronts" part. I actually am running reservoir 5160's up front. Sorry im not sure which 5100s would work for the front.

 

[AH64ID]

Ah man, im sorry. I didn't see the "fronts" part. I actually am running reservoir 5160's up front. Sorry im not sure which 5100s would work for the front.

One of the last few reasons I still want to lift the front is the ability to run 5160’s, but alas I doubt I lift it anytime in the mid to distant future.

 

[kingdaddy]

Ah man, im sorry. I didn't see the "fronts" part. I actually am running reservoir 5160's up front. Sorry im not sure which 5100s would work for the front.

No worries, I figured as much... Yeah the rears are the ones I'm concerned about anyway and I can't get an answer from Bilstein... guess they're "too big" to talk to end user customers...
You guys have been helpful and I think I can just go ahead and use the otherwise correct rear shocks and more or less ignore the caution about not being for rear air assist truck.
Probably just corporate CYA mumbo jumbo or something...if it was important, you would think they would be more clear. Fitment is obviously not an issue...
I may decide to just use the .5" lift springs (for the front obviously) from Thuren...mainly to get the better spring rate, not so much the lift. Not planning on running bigger tires than what I've already got and these trucks with the rear air are definitely closer to level already than the standard rear leaf trucks. And it tows VERY nicely, really happy with the rear air leveling for towing my big 5er.

 

[kingdaddy]

FINALLY got someone at Bilstein to respond to my inquiry (via FB Messenger) and here is a copy/paste of his reply:
(Quote)
I confirmed that we don't have a rear 4600 for 2015 Ram 3500 4WD with air suspension. Doubtful the 2019 model will work, our competition also shows different rear shocks for 2014-2018 vs 2019+

And to answer whether the non-air version would work on an air truck - I don't know for sure, but looking at the 2019 version where we do have air vs non, the lengths are significantly different. I suspect it's the same story in 2015.
(end Quote)
So... I do realize that standard (non air assist) suspension duallys do sit a bit higher in the rear, but "significantly different"?? Hard to believe that... Do they have a lot more suspension travel?
Thinking I will talk to CJC and get their input, maybe go with a different brand if they have a rear air assist shock available...

 

[gimmie11s]

I think the non-OEM air trucks sit about 1" higher than the OEM air rear ends.

I still need to get you that pic... ill try and remember to do that tonight after work.

 

[kingdaddy]

I agree... I would guesstimate around 1 maybe 2 inches at most! I think a guy down the street has a 3500 dually that maybe I can get a comparison measurement from...
I've got someone from DDP looking into it for me...real nice folks!

 

[kingdaddy]

I think the non-OEM air trucks sit about 1" higher than the OEM air rear ends.

I still need to get you that pic... ill try and remember to do that tonight after work.

Thanks for that... If you have a chance, it would be interesting to know what your rear shock length is... I do realize you have a 2" lift (I believe?). but that could be taken into account for comparison.

 

[kingdaddy]

UPDATE... OK, I've given up on finding the "right" shock for my truck from Bilstein... it turns out after finally talking to several people from Bilstein and elsewhere that although finding the right length of shocks with the appropriate amount of travel etc. is possible, the problem comes with the "tuning" (as Bilstein calls it) or in other words...internal valving. The spring rate on the air assist trucks and basic leaf spring trucks is quite different although the ultimate load carrying capability is similar.
Ram OEM part numbers for rear shocks are different for each of these two suspension variants....which is not terribly surprising.
Part number for the rear shocks for MY specific truck: Part # 68236649AE.
Again, this is an updated version of the original rear shock on my truck (and others of similar years...they changed in '19 I believe).

My local Dodge/Ram dealer gave me a quote of $382 apiece for these!! I checked online and the price was as low as $214 plus shipping and taxes.
THEN I found a not quite as local dealer (20 miles) that had them on sale for $210 and of course I can save on shipping.

So that is what I'm gonna do....NO, they're NOT Bilsteins but for what I do and the fact that they are rear shocks and IMO don't really need to be as high performance for what they do, I will be OK with that. Just not comfortable with getting a pair of shocks that are not necessarily right for my truck. I know, it might have worked out OK just making something work anyway....
Anyway, I am grateful for the input and advice etc. from everyone...especially the nice lady at DDP who went waaay above and beyond trying to help me find the right Bilsteins!

 

[gimmie11s]

Here are some more pics of mine as promised.