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Thuren front sway bar, Carli adj front track bar, Thuren rear track bar= phase I for my suspension solution...

Wheelz said:
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Thank you for the video.... This is my first time building on a non IFS off roader.... Some very good info here.... I noticed my steering wheel is slightly to the right as I drive straight down the road... I wonder if the jam nut is working its way loose a little.... I will look at this when I get under there in a week.... Welding the nut in two spots isn't a bad fix.... But I like that the Apex stuff is over built and priced at Moog price points.... Win win....again thank you
 
An adjustable track bar is an odd item to put into phase 1 without lift springs. It seems like double the work to pull it out and recenter once you know how high you plan to go.
 
johnmyster said:
An adjustable track bar is an odd item to put into phase 1 without lift springs. It seems like double the work to pull it out and recenter once you know how high you plan to go.
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I totally agree... I am not sure if I want to level the front yet or not... So it was a commitment issue and choice to buy it this way in case in the future I change the springs.... I may get wheels with +18 offset on 17" rims X 35" tires.... I can do the melt mod if I have to.... I like the apex steering video that is in this thread.... Didn't know all this steering stuff was going to be an issue or if it will be an issue...your input and the others here has been valuable so ... One phase at a time approach... And fix things I discern that I need to vs want to... Headed out to remove the plastic valance now
 
BlueXWA said:
I totally agree... I am not sure if I want to level the front yet or not... So it was a commitment issue and choice to buy it this way in case in the future I change the springs.... I may get wheels with +18 offset on 17" rims X 35" tires.... I can do the melt mod if I have to.... I like the apex steering video that is in this thread.... Didn't know all this steering stuff was going to be an issue or if it will be an issue...your input and the others here has been valuable so ... One phase at a time approach... And fix things I discern that I need to vs want to... Headed out to remove the plastic valance now
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I will say, Don's 2" springs (TF-351 IIRC) will most certainly improve the ride and you might not really need a track bar to run them. Those same springs are only about 1", maybe a little less, on my truck. My factory track bar didn't have any play in it at 10 years and 80k miles, and didn't really need adjustment for that little lift.

But then you're up 2" on the front and need shocks that can give the extra travel, which is at a minimum, a set of Bilstein 5100. (I think I got mine on ebay for under $100.) In my case I got the springs second hand too. So I was in $350 on the springs and shocks vs $420 on the Carli track bar.
 
johnmyster said:
I will say, Don's 2" springs (TF-351 IIRC) will most certainly improve the ride and you might not really need a track bar to run them. Those same springs are only about 1", maybe a little less, on my truck. My factory track bar didn't have any play in it at 10 years and 80k miles, and didn't really need adjustment for that little lift.

But then you're up 2" on the front and need shocks that can give the extra travel, which is at a minimum, a set of Bilstein 5100. (I think I got mine on ebay for under $100.) In my case I got the springs second hand too. So I was in $350 on the springs and shocks vs $420 on the Carli track bar.
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I don't know enough to tell you one way or another "what I need" to improve the ride ... I think sometimes people selling goods will make great videos to entice us (Carli or Thuren or CJC) to buy stuff, which I did after watching the videos but I also asked around and got good reports that these kits made significant difference.... I don't doubt the spring rate is part of the issue... Building my Xterra I special ordered progressive spring rated suspension parts... The application is different as the Xterra is my full-time trail runner ... Very capable... The Ram will be my forest road and light trail runner for high lake camping and over landing to Idaho, Washington, BC and fingers crossed Alaska
 
Adding a front adjustable track bar will not have any impact on your ride, they are for recentering the axle when the front suspension is lifted. You may notice a little firmer steering if your stock bushings are worn, but you also may not. If you’re not going to level I’d keep the front stock, aside from shocks and sway-bar, and put the money into other improvements.

The rear track bar is longer, so that does have an impact on the suspension.

BlueXWA said:
Thank you for the video.... This is my first time building on a non IFS off roader.... Some very good info here.... I noticed my steering wheel is slightly to the right as I drive straight down the road... I wonder if the jam nut is working its way loose a little.... I will look at this when I get under there in a week.... Welding the nut in two spots isn't a bad fix.... But I like that the Apex stuff is over built and priced at Moog price points.... Win win....again thank you
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The Jam nut that would work itself loose hasn’t been on these trucks since 2018, so sounds that’s an older video on the earlier 4th gen trucks. Welding the jam was a horribly stupid fix.
 
If I remember correctly Thuren states their trackbar is already
BlueXWA said:
I totally agree... I am not sure if I want to level the front yet or not... So it was a commitment issue and choice to buy it this way in case in the future I change the springs.... I may get wheels with +18 offset on 17" rims X 35" tires.... I can do the melt mod if I have to.... I like the apex steering video that is in this thread.... Didn't know all this steering stuff was going to be an issue or if it will be an issue...your input and the others here has been valuable so ... One phase at a time approach... And fix things I discern that I need to vs want to... Headed out to remove the plastic valance now
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FYI: Thuren trackbar works 0-2" lift without adjustments. Per their information

"This Trackbar is pre-set to 39-1/16” in length for any 1” to 3” lift height. The length specs noted are referencing a straight line to the center of each mounting hole. If you do not have a lift added to your front suspension, you may want to change the length to the 0” to 1” spec to dial in the geometry better. It is not mandatory to adjust our Trackbar, it will perform on a stock height truck without adjustment."
 
Hmmm...ok...well.... I think I will go ahead with the rear track bar install and the front sway bar install and hold the adjustable front track bar until I have further info... "Better" ride can mean different things for different contexts.... So I need more input from you all and talk with CJC again....cjc pointed me in the direction of the front track bar as a stand alone improvement....I don't mind new shocks and springs .... Sounds like I need more info
 
BlueXWA said:
Hmmm...ok...well.... I think I will go ahead with the rear track bar install and the front sway bar install and hold the adjustable front track bar until I have further info... "Better" ride can mean different things for different contexts.... So I need more input from you all and talk with CJC again....cjc pointed me in the direction of the front track bar as a stand alone improvement....I don't mind new shocks and springs .... Sounds like I need more info
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Honestly, you need to think about what it is you’re looking for, what size tires you want to fit, and exactly how you’re going to use it. Post that up and I’m sure you’ll get more pinpointed recommendations.

The truck in stock form will do what you’ve described to use it for, with a huge improvement just from the front sway bar alone.
 
Razzman said:
That's odd, I used the Thuren 1" lift springs on mine and got a a solid 1.5" lift, 30K later it's still 1.5"
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Because your truck is a 2500. The front height of the 3500 factory springs is ~0.5" higher to begin with.
 
johnmyster said:
Because your truck is a 2500. The front height of the 3500 factory springs is ~0.5" higher to begin with.
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I used the 1" spring specifically listed for the 2500, now whether they are the same springs or not can't say but mine also say TF-351 on them
 
johnmyster said:
Because your truck is a 2500. The front height of the 3500 factory springs is ~0.5" higher to begin with.
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For some reason I was thinking that 2500s were slightly higher than the 3500.

I wonder which is truly higher?
 
Razzman said:
I used the 1" spring specifically listed for the 2500, now whether they are the same springs or not can't say but mine also say TF-351 on them
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Per Thuren, if you use TF-351 on a 2500 CCSB 6.7, you get ~1" of lift over the factory springs. If you use TF-351 on a 3500 CCSB 6.7, you get 0.5" of lift over the factory springs.

This is not because the TF-351 is any different. It is because the 2500 factory springs and the 3500 factory springs are different...per Thuren.

I only have my one data point. It sounds like you gained more than I did, which verifies Thuren's info.
 
First drive after the install of said parts in the title... Noticeable difference in the back end not lurching to the passenger side.... So thumbs up for the rear track bar.... I may take the ♈ out tomorrow for forest roads and rough rocky forest road/ green trails (easiest trails in WA)... This will test the front sway bar some.... Granted I don't have a meter or sensor giving hard data for the before and after... I will know more after tomorrow... I know I can't compare it to the IFS of the smaller and lighter modified off roader I use.... I know it's a large 3/4 ton heavy truck.... So apples to watermelons...
 
BlueXWA said:
First drive after the install of said parts in the title... Noticeable difference in the back end not lurching to the passenger side.... So thumbs up for the rear track bar.... I may take the ♈ out tomorrow for forest roads and rough rocky forest road/ green trails (easiest trails in WA)... This will test the front sway bar some.... Granted I don't have a meter or sensor giving hard data for the before and after... I will know more after tomorrow... I know I can't compare it to the IFS of the smaller and lighter modified off roader I use.... I know it's a large 3/4 ton heavy truck.... So apples to watermelons...
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Any updates on this? Did you install front track bar? The description on CJC seems to suggest that even a stock, non-lifted front end would still benefit from it.
 
All has improved.... Researching if I need new springs for a better spring rate....but over all there is improvement.... 45/40 PSI in the tires when empty... No more rear wagging or lurching over bumps... The Carli suspension website has a nice write up about tires and wheels and psi...it is difficult to stomach the price we pay for vehicles and then have to pay more to make them a supreme ride... Maybe this is due to we bought work trucks to haul and we want them to be unicorns and do everything in them comfortably....
 
johnmyster said:
Can vouch for the Carli front trac bar and Thuren sway. Consider Thuren springs and a correct length shock while you're there if you're really after ride.

On my last truck airbags mostly stayed at 0 psi for I don't know how many years when not used due to a leaky line. Still worked when I got rid of the truck.
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I have been pricing the Thuren front springs and fix shocks... I realize Carli shocks are tuned as are synergy... Weighing my options and my wallet
 
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