Automatic Regen too often

[19Ram2500.Mega]

Would any of you

So an update on mine - hope mbarber, olejoe, etc see this.

Picked mine up today after over 70 days at the dealer. 480 miles put on it since dropped off. 28,080 miles on pick up

The bad - despite nearly 10% fuel dilution they were adamant that it was due to the extremely excessive regens. All they did was a basic pressure test using the computer. No dye, ohm, or sending injectors off for proper testing.

The interesting - he showed me my old dpf and a new one. The old dpf was at least 4" but probably 6" shorter front to back compared to the new one. The new is also completely bolted in with flanges for easy removal and cleaning. Old one was welded - he hadn't had the old one from my truck sent in for testing yet but the exhaust was largely one solid piece. Ram was requesting mine be returned to them for some reason. He said for the 22s that for some reason, likely parts shortages, ram knowingly used inferior parts. In this case DPFs that are not capable of dealing with the soot of the 6.7. This problem is further exacerbated by the German MAFs. He advised the the MAFs screwing up, paired with an undersized DPF - that once the MAF starts sending the wrong readings the undersized DPF cannot catch up even with "normal" regens. They are set up to fail essentially (my words) but greed to push trucks out the door meant they rolled the dice figuring they'd make more profit then any losses by the time most people's emissions warranty ran out. In Oklahoma emissions are 3 years 36k miles. Mine failed in under 28k miles.

Lastly, he point blank said that the new MAF and DPF and most recent flash should solve my issues... we shall see as I plan to do an oil change between 2-3k miles since my 9.3% fuel dilution was at 2700 miles on the oil. Then I will do another OA on that change.

With all that said I'm not happy about the lack of fuel leak testing, but I drove it 375 miles to my old hometown in Kansas for the weekend and will drive home Monday. 375 miles, and the DPF gauge didn't move off 0. Average speed was 72 mph with less then 10 minutes (I clocked) idle time for the drive. I got 19.8mpg hand calculated. Fill before I left and again upon arrival. My hopes are essentially nothing, but maybe some headway has been made. I told them my plans for the next oil change and OA, and that if dilution is high a very unhappy person will be returning with fleetguard OA in hand AGAIN...regardless of if I have a CEL or not

Did he specifically reference part shortages due to a specific reason? It seems even trucks prior the "pandemic" caused shortages have similar issues to the current 22 and up trucks.

I'm wondering if stellantis just decided to start cutting corners to increase profits and purposely chose to use inferior parts they could get a hold of cheaper....perhaps company surplus.

We all know the cp-4 was a disaster that never should have been incorporated into 19+ trucks, and while they continue to push out new "fixed" trucks, people are still waiting on their cp-3 replacements. The cp-4 is a time bomb waiting to go off.

Something just seems off. I think they know what the underlying issues are but it is either too expensive to fix or it will stop their ability to push out the new trucks (most likely culprit which would cut into their profits too much, thus upsetting investors). If they can just throw parts at failing trucks until warranties are up, they may be hedging losses pending people band together and take things to the next level.

Considering I have had roughly 39k (3 complete sets) in new injectors installed under warranty, not to mention an all new treatment system and exhaust system, I think my theory is somewhat well supported. The truck still isn't fixed. The fact we have to send in our own oil samples when you can smell diesel is just ridiculous, unless it is better for them not to know.

 

[mbarber84]

That's interesting if they have updated the DOC/DPF assembly, Could you take a look at the new one they put on for a part number, or it may be on the paperwork? Doing a quick search it appears that 68296341AE is the part number for 2019-2024 trucks.

View attachment 75221

One of the things that has always struck me as odd, is the offset inlet on the DPF. You would think that the soot would concentrate in one particular area on the face of the media, causing a higher buildup at a faster rate, rather than having a longer, tapered or conical inlet that is centered on the filter and would allow a more even distribution of the particulate across the face of the media

 

[22PearlRamMegaHD]

That looks like it’s welded to the DOC like all the other ones? Or am I missing something.

It looks like the one from the prior page but the one he showed me from my truck was cut out. I suppose it could've been due to seized nuts on the other flange? Or perhaps it just made it easier for them to pull out?

 

[22PearlRamMegaHD]

Would any of you

Did he specifically reference part shortages due to a specific reason? It seems even trucks prior the "pandemic" caused shortages have similar issues to the current 22 and up trucks.

I'm wondering if stellantis just decided to start cutting corners to increase profits and purposely chose to use inferior parts they could get a hold of cheaper....perhaps company surplus.

We all know the cp-4 was a disaster that never should have been incorporated into 19+ trucks, and while they continue to push out new "fixed" trucks, people are still waiting on their cp-3 replacements. The cp-4 is a time bomb waiting to go off.

Something just seems off. I think they know what the underlying issues are but it is either too expensive to fix or it will stop their ability to push out the new trucks (most likely culprit which would cut into their profits too much, thus upsetting investors). If they can just throw parts at failing trucks until warranties are up, they may be hedging losses pending people band together and take things to the next level.

Considering I have had roughly 39k (3 complete sets) in new injectors installed under warranty, not to mention an all new treatment system and exhaust system, I think my theory is somewhat well supported. The truck still isn't fixed. The fact we have to send in our own oil samples when you can smell diesel is just ridiculous, unless it is better for them not to know.

He didn't reference anything specific other then the DPF being inferior.

 

[superjoe83]

One of the things that has always struck me as odd, is the offset inlet on the DPF. You would think that the soot would concentrate in one particular area on the face of the media, causing a higher buildup at a faster rate, rather than having a longer, tapered or conical inlet that is centered on the filter and would allow a more even distribution of the particulate across the face of the media

I agree, plus the inlet to the DOC looks like it would swirl the air and cause turbulence, whether that would be an issue is beyond me. The 13-18 trucks had a much better DOC/DPF setup IMO

 

[mbarber84]

I agree, plus the inlet to the DOC looks like it would swirl the air and cause turbulence, whether that would be an issue is beyond me. The 13-18 trucks had a much better DOC/DPF setup IMO

View attachment 75239

I agree completely. It would be interesting to retrofit one of those on these trucks and see if it would perform better.

 

[22PearlRamMegaHD]

This the length of the filter area, I put the other end of the tape in the center of the weld

View attachment 75236

Mine is the same measurement as far as the new one is concerned. I wish I would've take a photograph of the old one that the tech said was from my truck. Even tho it was cut up. I did record the whole conversation, however, as Oklahoma is only a single party state....and I wanted to have proof of anything that seemed shady. With that said, the tech was very open and honest with me

 

[22PearlRamMegaHD]

I guess at this point I will have to take the wait and see approach on if the new DPF and MAF solved anything

 

[mbarber84]

Mine is the same measurement as far as the new one is concerned. I wish I would've take a photograph of the old one that the tech said was from my truck. Even tho it was cut up. I did record the whole conversation, however, as Oklahoma is only a single party state....and I wanted to have proof of anything that seemed shady. With that said, the tech was very open and honest with me

Is it possible that you may have been measuring / comparing the DOC of the old assembly to the DPF of the new one? The DOC is slightly shorter but still looks similar to a DPF both internally and externally.

 

[22PearlRamMegaHD]

Is it possible that you may have been measuring / comparing the DOC of the old assembly to the DPF of the new one? The DOC is slightly shorter but still looks similar to a DPF both internally and externally.

Entirely possible... sorry if I was confused. However the tech was the one that told me there was a size difference.

 

[Xrs_800]

Back to the drawing board on my 19 limited. Dealer stated the truck was missing 1 of the 6 pcm updates from the CP4 fuel pump recall. They reinstalled the correct update and drove the truck for 20miles around town. Dpf did not move nor go above 2Grams. Drove the truck 40miles home on the Interstate with no issues. Over the last few days my issues came back. DPF went from 2G to 6G in the matter of 5 miles intown. This was not stop and go. This was continues driving at 40 to 55mph. With my original trouble shooting I still believe it's a bad Maf sensor causing my issues. I swapped intakes, filters, and Maf sensor from a 2021 that had no issues. This was the only time my truck would passive regen was with the 2021s maf sensor. Today I overnighted a new Maf sensor from mopar. Hopefully have it Monday to throw in.

One other interesting thing happened today while regening. I hit a section of buckled concrete on an on ramp. Shook the truck decently and on the dash it went from automatic regen to the dpf guage for a split second then back to automatic regen. Going to take a look at the wiring harness to the dpf.

 

[mbarber84]

Back to the drawing board on my 19 limited. Dealer stated the truck was missing 1 of the 6 pcm updates from the CP4 fuel pump recall. They reinstalled the correct update and drove the truck for 20miles around town. Dpf did not move nor go above 2Grams. Drove the truck 40miles home on the Interstate with no issues. Over the last few days my issues came back. DPF went from 2G to 6G in the matter of 5 miles intown. This was not stop and go. This was continues driving at 40 to 55mph. With my original trouble shooting I still believe it's a bad Maf sensor causing my issues. I swapped intakes, filters, and Maf sensor from a 2021 that had no issues. This was the only time my truck would passive regen was with the 2021s maf sensor. Today I overnighted a new Maf sensor from mopar. Hopefully have it Monday to throw in.

One other interesting thing happened today while regening. I hit a section of buckled concrete on an on ramp. Shook the truck decently and on the dash it went from automatic regen to the dpf guage for a split second then back to automatic regen. Going to take a look at the wiring harness to the dpf.

Might want to check the differential pressure sensor and tubes as well

 

[OLEJOE]

Might want to check the differential pressure sensor and tubes as well

I’ve wondered about the tubes for the differential sensor getting stopped up.

 

[Deltron]

That's interesting if they have updated the DOC/DPF assembly, Could you take a look at the new one they put on for a part number, or it may be on the paperwork? Doing a quick search it appears that 68296341AE is the part number for 2019-2024 trucks.

View attachment 75221

I just picked mine up last week. It looks exactly like the one pictured. Can't read the sticker since it looks like it was plastic and melted.
I'm a bit confused as to what he's saying about flanges. Is he saying this is a two piece unit now?

 

[22PearlRamMegaHD]

I just picked mine up last week. It looks exactly like the one pictured. Can't read the sticker since it looks like it was plastic and melted.
I'm a bit confused as to what he's saying about flanges. Is he saying this is a two piece unit now?

That is what I was saying but I was mistaken.

 

[22PearlRamMegaHD]

Well, about 750 miles round-trip to Kansas and back. DPF gauge never went off 0 and I got 20.7mpg on the 375 mile trek home. I'm still not sold the problem is fixed, but for now things seem to be working.

 

[T143]

I dont have much to add to this, but very interested in whats going on here. I work on modern diesel engines but not truck engines. The vehicles do not do time based regen’s like you are mentioning the Ram has every 24 hours. The regen’s are based on how full the DPF is because everybody drives differently. But enough about that.
Picked up my 3500 on last Thursday and had a 4000km trip back home from the dealer I bought. She had 110 km on the clock and when I drove out the DPF was up to the first line. My conclusion was they are all idiots and probably had the vehicle idling for long times and confirmed checking the idle time and she had 7 hours already clocked. We have BP fuel here and the top diesel is Ultimate Diesel super high quality fuel, so on the trip Ultimate is not available everywhere so in the Outback we take what we can and I always opt for the lowest PPM. I actually could notice the difference in MPG between the fuels, obviously the Ultimate gave the best MPG.
At about 200km into our trip the DPF was empty and has not got a single bit of soot build up for the whole 4003km
Our first stop was 735km later, the next morning warmed her up and done the first oil change, oil and oil filter only.
From that moment we left the workshop we drove 34.5 hours non stop, yes we had to stop to refuel and run to the dunny but you get my drift. I dont have individual fuel stop MPG but my average fuel consumption was 11.6 litres per 100km and used 15.65 litres of AdBlue in 4003km
So I want to learn about this 24 hour regen how did you figure this out or is there official info about this please.
I will be towing this weekend as a pre test before our holidays in August.
Personally I am very surprised that my truck used that much AdBlue but it may be normal for the size of the engine.
Use to 3.0litre 6 cyl inline engines doing 16000km on less than 5 litres of AdBlue.

 

[22PearlRamMegaHD]

I dont have much to add to this, but very interested in whats going on here. I work on modern diesel engines but not truck engines. The vehicles do not do time based regen’s like you are mentioning the Ram has every 24 hours. The regen’s are based on how full the DPF is because everybody drives differently. But enough about that.
Picked up my 3500 on last Thursday and had a 4000km trip back home from the dealer I bought. She had 110 km on the clock and when I drove out the DPF was up to the first line. My conclusion was they are all idiots and probably had the vehicle idling for long times and confirmed checking the idle time and she had 7 hours already clocked. We have BP fuel here and the top diesel is Ultimate Diesel super high quality fuel, so on the trip Ultimate is not available everywhere so in the Outback we take what we can and I always opt for the lowest PPM. I actually could notice the difference in MPG between the fuels, obviously the Ultimate gave the best MPG.
At about 200km into our trip the DPF was empty and has not got a single bit of soot build up for the whole 4003km
Our first stop was 735km later, the next morning warmed her up and done the first oil change, oil and oil filter only.
From that moment we left the workshop we drove 34.5 hours non stop, yes we had to stop to refuel and run to the dunny but you get my drift. I dont have individual fuel stop MPG but my average fuel consumption was 11.6 litres per 100km and used 15.65 litres of AdBlue in 4003km
So I want to learn about this 24 hour regen how did you figure this out or is there official info about this please.
I will be towing this weekend as a pre test before our holidays in August.
Personally I am very surprised that my truck used that much AdBlue but it may be normal for the size of the engine.
Use to 3.0litre 6 cyl inline engines doing 16000km on less than 5 litres of AdBlue.

Based on my experience having had a 3.0 ram ecodiesel, and now a 6.7 cummins. With the conversion from liters to gallons and km to miles - you are experiencing what I see. The 3.0 ecodiesel used about 1 gallon of adblue per 1000 miles, and the cummins about 1 gallon per 600 miles (unloaded).

My ecodiesel was setup for hunting the mountains - 6" of lift and 35x12.50 10 ply tires. Before a tune i got about 19mpg on the ecodiesel, and after a tune about 24mpg.

My ram 2500 cummins is mostly highway speeds of 65-75mph (100+ kph), and I get 19-21 mpg typically

 

[22PearlRamMegaHD]

So I noticed something as I was getting all my tools and things loaded back in my truck. The Donaldson filter was in it's package in the bed. Theres a fleetguard stratopore filter on my truck instead. I called the dealer, and spoke to the tech to inquire. He advised Donaldson filters dont have an anti flow back valve which makes for "dry starts". Knowing that oil less starts are bad for my gasser 94 z71 with roller cam, hydraulic lifters, etc...if true makes me not want to use the DBL filter and maybe just keep as an emergency back up.

I was curious if you guys know about that with the DBL filters?

 

[OLEJOE]

So I noticed something as I was getting all my tools and things loaded back in my truck. The Donaldson filter was in it's package in the bed. Theres a fleetguard stratopore filter on my truck instead. I called the dealer, and spoke to the tech to inquire. He advised Donaldson filters dont have an anti flow back valve which makes for "dry starts". Knowing that oil less starts are bad for my gasser 94 z71 with roller cam, hydraulic lifters, etc...if true makes me not want to use the DBL filter and maybe just keep as an emergency back up.

I was curious if you guys know about that with the DBL filters?

The Stratapore filters and any other filter, that I know of for the 6.7 Cummins, doesn’t have an ADBV. What I have noticed with the Stratapore filter is that it does drain back more of the oil than the cellulose filters do. This is from letting the truck sit before doing an oil change and observing the amount of oil still in the filter. This probably is because of the flow the Stratapore filter is capable of. If it flows easily one direction then it flows just as easily in the other direction. I have run the DBL and noticed that the oil level drops down in them also but not as much as the Stratapore filter does. Running the Baldwin cellulose filter it drops very little.