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Ram 2500 brakes

All right you all I told you I was OCD and I got sick and tired of dealing with this issue. All the dealership was doing was throwing parts at it. It wasn't fixing it obviously. I noticed that every time I wash the truck or it rained the pedal would come back to the way it's supposed to feel. With that said I went through connectors and grounding straps to test to see which ones would make it react that way and lo and behold the three grounding straps that are all tied into the same harness that the ABS connector is in work corroded. Spraying those grounding straps gave me that same result so I pulled them and cleaned them. I used a scan tool to look at the primary circuit pressure and as I wiggled those grounds they would fluctuate. Cleaning them has made a solid difference although I am still getting some fluctuation it looks like the symptoms are from a faulty ground. The dealership at this point has absolutely no idea and they're not really interested in helping other than throwing parts at it especially when a Master tech told me to replace the master cylinder. Which in fact was bad because I was also having the symptoms where the truck felt like it was stopping with all fronts. But it didn't get rid of the inconsistent pedal change. I will continue to monitor with the scan tool and keep you updated but with several test drives where normally it would eventually throw another symptom or two during that drive I have so far had none
So final update as I am determined to solve this problem and get you guys a fix as well. Although the grounds helped, the issue lies with the ABS module connector. If I spray just a small amount of water on that connector that fluctuation in that brake pressure stops. I did pull the connector and inspect all of the pens and their tightness. All seemed fine. I pulled the back shell off of the connector as well and inspected everything from the back end and I don't see anything that has been chafed or corroded etc. Nevertheless a little bit of moisture getting into that connector solves the problem until it dries back out and all of this has been confirmed with the scan tool. At this point that is way more information than anybody else has had and should get an official repair through the dealership at this point and then we can all have our brakes the way they're supposed to be. As for the numbers the scan tool is showing a fluctuation between zero and 0.12. from my understanding the sensor is getting irregular data and thinks that the brakes are being slightly applied and since the data is constantly fluctuating when you finally do touch the brakes they seemingly go halfway or more before they engage because it doesn't know what the hell's going on. Mist a little bit of water on that connector and it instantly stops fluctuating and you can drive the truck with what I would call an amazing brake pedal feel. Try it yourself see if that's what's causing your issue. I can't imagine that it would be anything else. I've been digging at this for months this is what I've come up with and then take it to the dealer and tell them to freaking fix it.
 
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All right you all I told you I was OCD and I got sick and tired of dealing with this issue. All the dealership was doing was throwing parts at it. It wasn't fixing it obviously. I noticed that every time I wash the truck or it rained the pedal would come back to the way it's supposed to feel. With that said I went through connectors and grounding straps to test to see which ones would make it react that way and lo and behold the three grounding straps that are all tied into the same harness that the ABS connector is in work corroded. Spraying those grounding straps gave me that same result so I pulled them and cleaned them. I used a scan tool to look at the primary circuit pressure and as I wiggled those grounds they would fluctuate. Cleaning them has made a solid difference although I am still getting some fluctuation it looks like the symptoms are from a faulty ground. The dealership at this point has absolutely no idea and they're not really interested in helping other than throwing parts at it especially when a Master tech told me to replace the master cylinder. Which in fact was bad because I was also having the symptoms where the truck felt like it was stopping with all fronts. But it didn't get rid of the inconsistent pedal change. I will continue to monitor with the scan tool and keep you updated but with several test drives where normally it would eventually throw another symptom or two during that drive I have so far had none
Please keep us posted as to your success, you are the closest person to a solution than any of the other posts I have read here. Let us know if you decide to replace the ground, or whatever you try next. Thank you!!
 
Please keep us posted as to your success, you are the closest person to a solution than any of the other posts I have read here. Let us know if you decide to replace the ground, or whatever you try next. Thank you!!
Well after working on it for almost 3 days I don't believe it's a ground issue grounds are checking fine. There is some type of voltage interference or something I'm not really sure. I know that these are known for some issues with their tipm. It's going into the dealer with all of this new knowledge that I have and they're going to take it from here. I'm running out of patience and I know I'll love the truck that much more when it's fixed. From what I've gathered with the pressure sensor fluctuating the way that it is it definitely has an effect on the way the break pedal feels. I'm quite confident that it is not supposed to sit at zero as there's not enough hydraulic pressure. It's definitely not supposed to fluctuate. What feels normal to me is that like .12-.18 on the voltage. It primes and holds that particular line pressure and that's what gives you that responsive pedal. I've already told the dealer I do not want the truck back until it's fixed and they are not to throw parts at it like the other dealer was trying to do.
 
I know you think you’ve found something, but you haven’t. Nothing you can do electronically is going to “fix” the brakes. You may cause the ABS system to keep it partially pressurized all the time, but all that’s going to do is cause other things to not work right, and probably overheat your brakes in the long run.

These brakes are mechanical and hydraulic, not electric.

You’re risking the safety of yourself and everyone else around you on the road by messing with a system you don’t understand. Please stop.
 
I know you think you’ve found something, but you haven’t. Nothing you can do electronically is going to “fix” the brakes. You may cause the ABS system to keep it partially pressurized all the time, but all that’s going to do is cause other things to not work right, and probably overheat your brakes in the long run.

These brakes are mechanical and hydraulic, not electric.

You’re risking the safety of yourself and everyone else around you on the road by messing with a system you don’t understand. Please stop.
I actually know exactly what I'm doing. What I am doing it's called diagnosing. Because I and everybody else that is having this issue know that this is not how brakes are supposed to perform. And although they are a hydraulic system the pressure is maintained by the ABS block and the pressure sensor. That sensor is not supposed to fluctuate. So there is either an intermittent power issue there is electrical interference or the sensor itself is bad. Seeing how they have already replaced my abs block and the symptoms remained it is not the block or the sensor. Matter of fact it's more dangerous to continue to drive the vehicle in its current state then it is for me to look at live sensor data. Looking at that data is not hurting anything and since this portion of my vehicle is not covered under warranty it's irrelevant. When a Master tech is throwing hard parts at my truck instead of doing what I'm doing that says a lot. I have decades of mechanical experience so I appreciate your concern but if you're not experiencing this issue and are desperately looking for a resolution skip over my posts.
 
Looking at readings is not the same as spraying water on connectors. The reason the reading stopped fluctuating is because you shorted it out.
 
Incorrect the reason why it stabilizes because the connection was restored. These systems are just as much electronic as they are hydraulic. What I did was no different than when it rains. Which is how I figured out how to duplicate this issue. Matter of fact the water is what makes the brakes feel like they're supposed to. Which points to an electronic issue. Your previous reply and so many contradictions in it. I'll have you know that the private shops that I have spoke to about this I've told me how spot on I am. I may not have the answer but I'm going down the correct road and that's why I said the dealership is going to be responsible for the rest. I've essentially done their job for them. Spraying a little water on a connector is not going to damage the system.
 
Looking at readings is not the same as spraying water on connectors. The reason the reading stopped fluctuating is because you shorted it out.
^This^
Incorrect the reason why it stabilizes because the connection was restored. These systems are just as much electronic as they are hydraulic. What I did was no different than when it rains. Which is how I figured out how to duplicate this issue. Matter of fact the water is what makes the brakes feel like they're supposed to. Which points to an electronic issue. Your previous reply and so many contradictions in it. I'll have you know that the private shops that I have spoke to about this I've told me how spot on I am. I may not have the answer but I'm going down the correct road and that's why I said the dealership is going to be responsible for the rest. I've essentially done their job for them. Spraying a little water on a connector is not going to damage the system.
@jsalbre is right. I was going to reply to these crazy shenanigans but typing one handed post shoulder surgery is a PITA so I refrained expecting someone else here would point out how idiotic this is. You're artificially introducing voltage where there should be none. For trucks with ACC, the system would alter the voltage/current supplied to the ABS module to "pre-stage" the pads closer to the rotors. You're artificially doing the same thing. It proves nothing.

What you also fail to realize is the system is also pedal position and pedal speed sensitive. In a panic stop, the rate and pressure at which the pedal is depressed is also used to accelerate the pad pressure. This is nothing new, my 2003 Audi does this.

Go review this thread and stop being an idiot and messing about with systems you know nothing about.

 
^This^

@jsalbre is right. I was going to reply to these crazy shenanigans but typing one handed post shoulder surgery is a PITA so I refrained expecting someone else here would point out how idiotic this is. You're artificially introducing voltage where there should be none. For trucks with ACC, the system would alter the voltage/current supplied to the ABS module to "pre-stage" the pads closer to the rotors. You're artificially doing the same thing. It proves nothing.

What you also fail to realize is the system is also pedal position and pedal speed sensitive. In a panic stop, the rate and pressure at which the pedal is depressed is also used to accelerate the pad pressure. This is nothing new, my 2003 Audi does this.

Go review this thread and stop being an idiot and messing about with systems you know nothing about.

You are making a lot of assumptions. I don't have acc. I have also read through all of the information pertaining to this issue. It is not normal and I have multiple dealerships stating the same thing. The brake pedal should not travel halfway before hydraulic pressure is felt. The brake pedal should never change feel throughout the day while driving. Never in the history of any vehicle on the planet does the pedal feel firm one break cycle and then soft and almost to the floor the next. Again I know what I'm doing and I know how to diagnose. Since the ABS module was changed in the symptoms did not it's not the ABS module.

Now it could very well be software but if it was software then dew point in humidity and or a rain would not affect this issue and yet it does. So while monitoring this with the scan tool and looking at the sensor data the brake pedal feel and it's change coincides with what I am feeling when I'm looking at the sensor data.
Sensor data should not be all over the place when the brake pedal is not being depressed. No matter how the system is designed the way mine and others that complain about this issue in the form no that this system should not function the way it is currently functioning. There is a known issue and it doesn't affect all of the trucks on the road. So again your assumptions and what you think I know are based on nothing. You have no idea the degree of knowledge and experience I have. And now I have the same capability as a dealership when it comes to monitoring sensor data. Which helps even more obviously that's why they possess those tools. There isn't anything that I am failing to realize you who fails to realize.

Now unless you have a solution to fixing these problem, stop pretending like you have all of the knowledge and pretending like this is a normal break function for these trucks. Because if it was a normal process all of these trucks would be doing it. And there would be a whole lot of people complaining about it. Not only that but it would also carry over into the diesel world which it has not. Now you can stop at the name calling and learn how to talk through a problem like an adult. And just so you know I am going to be the reason why this issue gets resolved because I am the only one who has clearly had the determination and the persistence to find out what it is. And when that happens which is coming very very soon I will make sure to post it just for you to read.

Symptoms. Inconsistent brake pedal pressure / feel. System does not actuate the ABS when the pedal is excessively soft and or has excessive travel. That is a danger in itself. When towing a trailer because there is so much travel it engages the trailer brakes because it's a progressive braking system. So the sensor data is telling the brake controller to send more power to the brakes on the trailer which causes the trailer to snatch. Disconnecting the battery terminal for 5 minutes resets this problem and it goes away for up to about 4 days. Then it gets erratic data from those sensors and the module is trying to compensate for it. Again leading to a brake pedal that feels different every single time you touch it doesn't matter if it's a panic stop or a regular stop. Then it rains or I wash my truck and then when I drive it the brake pedal feels normal. Why would that be, that would be because moisture has gotten into an electrical circuit or connector and has completed that circuit. Which also leads to the high possibility that it is a loose connector or a faulty ground somewhere in the system causing electrical interference. This is easily found by using a multimeter and a scan tool. Which is what I have spent the last 3 days doing.

Thank you I appreciate your concern but you're not helping the situation you're only aggravating it.
 
OK sport. Let us know when you figure it out and Ram issues the TSB fix.
I didn't say that issue a tsp for the fix. What I do know is my truck will be fixed one way or the other. It certainly won't be because of your help. You call me an idiot but if you knew anything about a vehicle you would know that brakes don't function this way and for some reason you're upset because you think that they should. That post will be for the folks that are having the issue and want it resolved as badly as I do. So be watching out for that message sport
 
1. Inconsistent Brake Pedal Pressure / Feel

This is not normal and usually results from:

Faulty brake pressure sensors (especially the primary circuit pressure sensor).

An ABS module misinterpreting data or inconsistently applying logic based on sensor inputs.

Moisture or electrical interference (possibly from humidity or water ingress).

2. ABS Not Activating During Soft Pedal Condition

This suggests that the ABS system does not perceive the braking force as being sufficient to trigger ABS, possibly due to:

Inaccurate readings from the master cylinder pressure sensor or wheel speed sensors.

Internal ABS module logic error, leading it to misjudge required braking intervention.

The system may be in a degraded mode, affecting how it applies hydraulic pressure.


3. Brake Controller Over-Braking the Trailer

This one’s a big safety red flag:

Most likely due to fluctuating pressure sensor data, the system is telling the trailer brake controller that you’re braking hard.

Since trailer brake controllers (especially factory-integrated ones) work off brake pedal pressure or position data, false input causes erratic trailer brake behavior, resulting in the "snatching."

4. Problem Resets After Disconnecting the Battery

This supports the idea that the ABS module or related logic is “learning” or interpreting bad sensor data.

Battery disconnect likely resets adaptive values or clears temporary faults.

The issue returning after a few days implies the problem is cumulative—a sensor starts to give bad data, the module adapts to it incorrectly, and the issue reappears.

5. Rain or Washing the Truck Temporarily Fixes It

This is very unusual but strongly suggests:

Humidity or water may be improving electrical conductivity across a problematic connector.

A specific sensor (pressure sensor, ABS module connector, or wheel speed sensor) is intermittent or has corrosion, and the moisture is providing a temporary fix by completing or stabilizing the connection.

Most Likely Root Causes


1. Faulty primary circuit pressure sensor

If it’s reporting wrong pressure values, the ABS and brake controller logic will go haywire.



2. Internal ABS module fault or software issue

Especially since the issue is “reset” by a battery pull. A software update (if available) or replacement may be needed.



3. Corroded or failing connector (ABS block, master cylinder sensor, wheel speed sensors)



Given that washing the truck temporarily helps, you could be dealing with a flaky electrical connection.

The primary brake pressure sensor should give a stable, low reading (usually 0 to 0.1 V or equivalent pressure units) when the pedal is at rest.

Fluctuation between 0 and 0.2 (or higher), especially while at rest, is not normal and will absolutely confuse the ABS module, causing:

Inconsistent brake assist

Erratic pedal feel

Faulty ABS or trailer brake modulation

And possibly lead the system to think you're riding the brake (or not braking) when you actually are.


When it stabilizes at 0.12, the ABS logic assumes a consistent light foot pressure — which allows the system to behave somewhat normally.

When it drops to 0 or jumps around, the system may:

Misinterpret braking effort

Fail to engage ABS when needed

Overcompensate on trailer brakes



The fact that you can correlate a better pedal feel with a stable 0.12 reading points directly to that sensor—or its wiring—as the root cause.


But I'm the idiot...this is not normal and the fact that you think it is shows just how little either of you understand the system and how it works. Sounds like I understand it far better. Sensors are not supposed to send erratic data. I'd be willing to put money on it, if I put a scan tool on every truck that experiences this issue, the primary circuit pressure sensor is acting exactly like mine is. Bouncing all over the place.

These systems are obviously very sensitive and any voltage fluxuation will confuse it. As to what is causing the erratic data is beyond me but I have been working very closely with the service manager and their director of operations. They agree it's not normal. For whatever reason, the sensor data was never looked at before or after the module was replaced. I take it in Monday morning and I have a pile of diagnostic data to give them. I'm not just a truck owner. I'm a business owner, a lifelong mechanic and have spent many years working for the dealership with technicians. Which is why I took the time to do all of this. Having my truck in the shop more than it already has been, making payments on it and the ungodly rates to rent an hd truck to tow my work rig is not feasible. I do not have all the answers nor do I pretend to, but I do know how to properly diagnose. Every aspect of my life I have had to rely on myself. This is no different.

My efforts to post this here is to HELP, to solve the problem. Not accepting the ******** lazy excuse that this is normal, get used to it. My 2023 Duramax did not have this issue. Ford doesn't have this issue and call it normal, because it's not. If they can't fix it (not much of a dealership if they can't) I will let it go. These are not the first trucks/ vehicles with this technology yet to my knowledge they are the first to have this issue.

The "idiot" "sport" etc is unnecessary, immature and completely defeats the purpose of this forum and unless you have some first hand knowledge from the manufacturer saying they intentionally designed them to function this way, keep quiet. We're trying to solve a problem. Ram is known to ignore problems like these. I have contacted the state to start a case for a potential recall. You know, the things responsible adults to when there's safety issues with new (ish) vehicles. I would encourage everyone who has this issue to do the same as it will escalate it that much faster. Listening to the ******** I got today gets us nowhere.

Enjoy the novel, I'll be back next week with an update for the folks who refuse to accept it as normal.
 
What you’re saying is literally impossible unless you’ve built some custom braking system into your truck. The ABS pump is the only electronic item that can have any effect on your braking. It does not and should not do anything unless the ABS is activated by wheel skid or you have ACC and it’s engaging to slow the truck down. Outside of those two situations nothing should ever happen that isn’t purely mechanical/hydraulic. If something is happening when you unplug the battery or do anything with the electronics then that result you’re getting isn’t something that should be happening. In other words, that’s not a fix, it’s a fault.
 
What you’re saying is literally impossible unless you’ve built some custom braking system into your truck. The ABS pump is the only electronic item that can have any effect on your braking. It does not and should not do anything unless the ABS is activated by wheel skid or you have ACC and it’s engaging to slow the truck down. Outside of those two situations nothing should ever happen that isn’t purely mechanical/hydraulic. If something is happening when you unplug the battery or do anything with the electronics then that result you’re getting isn’t something that should be happening. In other words, that’s not a fix, it’s a fault.
You're right it's not a fix. what it is, is a reset of the system. Because if the system was working as designed then it would immediately come back feeling like it did prior to the reset / loss of power. The ABS module is not just responsible for wheel skid. The valving inside of the module is responsible for the brake feel under normal braking conditions. The software is programmed to hold a certain brake pressure at all times. So while you're correct you are also incorrect. There is so much built into an hcu. There is a primary circuit sensor, there could be anywhere between 6 and 16 different valves depending on its features, it's also responsible for proportioning brake fluid to each wheel in a pre-programmed manner. This doesn't have anything to do with a custom anything for the brakes, as I have done nothing to modify them from their original form. The simple fact of the matter is every single vehicle ever built even the ones that have this type of technology have never had a brake pedal that changes every time you touch it. The fact that it does change, it changes when I get in the truck in the morning after it rains, it changes if I disconnect the battery and reconnect it. It changes upwards of five times per drive cycle throughout my day. If I drive an hour to a job it is changed upwards of 10 different times and I've done nothing. Matter of fact when I disconnect the battery and I'm looking at sensor data that fluctuation in the primary circuit pressure sensor stops and it stays stopped for an undetermined amount of time. The absolute second that it starts to fluctuate again my brakes go back to feeling like ****. Prior to it fluctuating they are amazing. So that amazingness is exactly how the brakes are supposed to feel and respond. And not only that the truck stops a hundred times better. Which means the fluctuation has stopped the hcu is correctly pressurizing the system and proportioning correctly. This really isn't that complicated, but with that said it is because something is simple as a loose pin and the ABS connector, corrosion, an intermittent faulty ground can be responsible for the primary circuit sensor and it's fluctuation. That sensor should be displaying a steady consistent number. And it's not. Can't have an electric system relying on rapidly fluctuating pressure when you're not even touching the brakes. I have been chasing this issue for 2 months. And I haven't been chasing it alone I've got private shops and the dealership. Matter of fact two dealerships. We've all roughly come to the same conclusion and come Monday when I dump all of this diagnostic data on them there's absolutely no reason why when I get this truck back it can't be fixed.

Anybody that wants to argue the fact and say that I'm wrong has no mechanical electrical or sensor knowledge when it comes to these vehicles whatsoever. No vehicle that I've ever owned has ever responded to the battery being disconnected like that. No vehicle that I've owned has ever had feel change throughout the day multiple times without cycling the ignition even. These are all red flags to anybody that has any sort of mechanical knowledge that the system isn't working correctly. Can't believe I even have to explain this. Nevertheless I know that I'm right because of the vast knowledge that I have with vehicles and these complex systems. I don't have to be a Master tech to understand how something works. Even the Master tech at the first dealership I took it to was like well I guess the master cylinders the next thing on the list. It's like he never even hooked up a f****** scan tool. And they had my truck for an entire week.
 
What you’re saying is literally impossible unless you’ve built some custom braking system into your truck. The ABS pump is the only electronic item that can have any effect on your braking. It does not and should not do anything unless the ABS is activated by wheel skid or you have ACC and it’s engaging to slow the truck down. Outside of those two situations nothing should ever happen that isn’t purely mechanical/hydraulic. If something is happening when you unplug the battery or do anything with the electronics then that result you’re getting isn’t something that should be happening. In other words, that’s not a fix, it’s a fault.
Also I might add that I'm confused as to why you think that I have been tampering with my brake system. What makes you think that I have done anything to this system other than diagnosing. I bought this truck with 34,000 miles on it it now has 41,000 miles on it. And in that time nothing has changed. Except for the damn brake pedal feel. And you guys sitting here sharing information from other threads talking about how this system is designed to change its feel depending on how rapidly you come off the gas pedal or how quickly you come on to the brake pedal is complete b*******. While that may be true while the breaking system is working as designed it is not currently working as designed. Pulling a trailer or not pulling a trailer I cannot tell you how many times I've almost been in an accident because the f****** truck won't stop. It should never come close to being on the floor by the time I come to that stop.

Just to clarify I've done nothing to this truck other than diagnose it. I have setback with a dealer level scan tool and monitored all system and sensor data related to the ABS system.

Brake pedal travel sensor will fluctuate less than 100th of a volt. The primary circuit pressure sensor fluctuates from 0 to 2/10 of a volt. It's not a slow fluctuation it literally looks like I'm stepping on the pedal just a little bit. That right there isn't normal and that I guarantee you is what's throwing the system off. But that doesn't necessarily mean that the sensor is at fault especially since the hcu has less than 10,000 miles on it. Any basic research whatsoever will tell you that a fluctuating sensor is caused by malfunction, some type of electrical interference in the system like noise electrical noise from other electrical systems or it could be a ground that's not correctly grounding or intermittently grounding or multiple interference type issues with the connector where they're not securely connected to the pins on the hcu. Your picture shows your truck in water. I've had several wranglers with these exact systems and drove them through water. Guess what never happened, coming out of that water the brakes felt the same as they did before it went in. So how is that any different than when it rains or if I take a spray bottle and miss the connector? It's not. Which brings me back to my point that I somehow in some reason have to defend among seemingly intelligent other men is that it is not working as designed.

That right there is way more Master tech level work than I ever got at the dealership. We'll see what I get at this dealership. If they're just going to throw parts at it then I'm going to start a third case with ram as they are well aware of this issue. And then I will be taking it to a different dealership or ram will be having some conversations with them or I'll be hiring an attorney one or the other.
 
If what you’re saying is correct then pulling fuse F02, which is the ABS fuse, should make every truck have terrible brake feel.

I assume you’ve tried pulling that fuse and seeing how the truck reacts.
 
If what you’re saying is correct then pulling fuse F02, which is the ABS fuse, should make every truck have terrible brake feel.

I assume you’ve tried pulling that fuse and seeing how the truck reacts.
pulling the fuse won't stop the sensor from fluxuation, it'll just kill the power all together. If there is a problem that throws a code it essentially is the same thing and will default to whatever it's supposed to. So if the brakes are crap now the pulling the fuse would likely make it better
 
pulling the fuse won't stop the sensor from fluxuation, it'll just kill the power all together. If there is a problem that throws a code it essentially is the same thing and will default to whatever it's supposed to. So if the brakes are crap now the pulling the fuse would likely make it better
Pulling the fuse will stop anything electronic from affecting the brakes.
 
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