Payload on 2500 and 3500

[sstoner911]

Look up the Reese Sidewinder, it makes 5th wheels work with the ramboxes. Has a few downsides but it works.

To the post above I honestly can't understand how a 2500 with airbags would be miserable but a srw 3500 would be a dream to tow a big tag trailer. Did the 2500 have factory air? That won't be as stable as coils+aftermarket bags.

The biggest downside with the 2500 is that the coils are softer and set pretty far inward on the axle. If you put some solid aftermarket bags where the bump stops are, they are distributing the weight at the furthest ends of the axle.

Aside from the leafs vs. coils...the 3500 is the same damn truck. Drives me crazy in the RV forums when the tow police show up and say crap like, "it'll pull the trailer just fine, but will it stop it?" It's the same truck man! Now drw is a completely different story, no arguing that is a much more stable platform

The biggest difference was the weight of the tow rig....the 3500 is heavier and helped in reducing sway. When the wind was present the 2500 was pretty good as long as you didn't get above 60 mph. The 3500 in the same winds I just set the cruise at 70 and go. The 2500 had the Airlift 5000.

So really the 2500 and the 3500 are not the same truck at all in many ways.

 

[LossPrev]

The biggest difference was the weight of the tow rig....the 3500 is heavier and helped in reducing sway. When the wind was present the 2500 was pretty good as long as you didn't get above 60 mph. The 3500 in the same winds I just set the cruise at 70 and go. The 2500 had the Airlift 5000.

So really the 2500 and the 3500 are not the same truck at all in many ways.

How is the 3500 heavier? What makes them different?

I have been doing a ton of research as we ordered a 5th wheel and there is 1 difference between a 2019+ 2500 and 3500, leaf springs vs coils. Thats it. If you get a HO then you get a 12" rear end but the SO 3500 gets the same 11.5" that I have.

 

[sstoner911]

My 33ft new bumper pull TT is 7,600 GVWR. The hell y'all putting in those things to push 19k?

It was a lowboy equipment trailer....I would venture to say we were probably over a little in weight at 19,000 lbs... but it had to get home somehow.

 

[sstoner911]

what does a 16k lb bumper pull holiday trailer look like?

No idea..,,,

Holiday? Are you british?

 

[kobra]

Hi all, I have a RAM 3500 HO SRW LoneStar and want a higher trim.

Not a full time camper but have plan to own this car for long time and tow a 5th wheel.

I have bad experience to tow a 9000lbs TT with RAM 1500 HEMI, but unfortunately got a lower trim and not satisfied (there's not heated seats and steering wheel!)

This time I want a higher trim, but RAM 2500 payload is only 1800Lbs, which frankly to say most 5th wheel will over that payload.

So the best choice is to go directly a 3500, right?

I want order a 3500 limited HO SRW, RAMBOX kept. Is it look weird? Haha.

Really do not understand a 6.7 Diesel can only load 1800 lbs with high trim.

The payload math for a 2500 is this; max GVWR 10,000lbs, to remain as a class 2b truck. So, a truck with an 1800lb payload must weigh 8200lbs.
I had a 2016 RAM 2500 limited cummins CC SB and it had about 2100lbs of payload with no Ramboxes. As others have mentioned the higher trim levels add a lot of extra weight, and so does the cummins.
When you consider that a 3500 has a payload of 11,800 for the CC SB, for that same 8200lb truck you have effectively doubled the payload.
My 2020 RAM 3500 HO CC SB has a payload just north of 3600lbs, so comparing to what you are seeing with the 2500 they must weigh similar. Likely the RAMboxes add a few hundred pounds as I don't have them but do have the extra weight of the 3500 HO package (suspension, transimission, rear axle, etc). I'm surprised that the math seems to indicate the Ramboxes weigh about 300lbs. Unless I missed something...

B

 

[JohnandDonna]

If I had decided to go with a 5th wheel I would have gotten a 3500 without the Ram Boxes. Most of the time when you get a 5th wheel its because its bigger inside and has slide outs (also heavier). Plus I don't think it makes much sense to get a 2500 with a diesel as you lose too much carry capacity in the truck (about a thousand pounds). If you want a diesel go 3500. However if you go with a TT (our is 30' 9k in weight) the 2500 gasser with Ram Boxes makes sense. Love the Ram Boxes for all the hitch stuff and X chocks and other misc.

 

[sstoner911]

If I had decided to go with a 5th wheel I would have gotten a 3500 without the Ram Boxes. Most of the time when you get a 5th wheel its because its bigger inside and has slide outs (also heavier). Plus I don't think it makes much sense to get a 2500 with a diesel as you lose too much carry capacity in the truck (about a thousand pounds). If you want a diesel go 3500. However if you go with a TT (our is 30' 9k in weight) the 2500 gasser with Ram Boxes makes sense. Love the Ram Boxes for all the hitch stuff and X chocks and other misc.

I ran in to guy in St David Arizona, he had the Hemi 2500 long bed - similar TT(bumper pull) to yours in weight but he also had a 50" wide 2 seater SXS he carried on a bed flat deck carrier. He would have probably been over the payload with the diesel.

 

[LossPrev]

I read that 2500 gas had a dual-rate tandem diaphragm vacuum while 2500 diesel and all 3500 had hydro-boost brakes.

My regular cab long bed 3500 4x4 SRW with 6.4L has 4,600 payload and 17k+ towing for reference.

That could be very true, don't know the specs on the 6.4 hemi trucks at all. I was only referring to the 6.7 trucks(and mostly SO as there are some small differences on the HO like the 12" rear end like I mentioned)

So this is a good example, and I'll add that I have nothing against gassers nor am I trying to be a "diesel elitist", but I would much rather be towing 17,000 with my 2500 diesel and some suspension upgrades over a 3500 gasser. I would be over by more than 1000lbs on tow rating and probably more than 1000lbs of payload but you would be within specs. I would feel much safer in the 2500 still.

 

[kobra]

The biggest difference was the weight of the tow rig....the 3500 is heavier and helped in reducing sway. When the wind was present the 2500 was pretty good as long as you didn't get above 60 mph. The 3500 in the same winds I just set the cruise at 70 and go. The 2500 had the Airlift 5000.

So really the 2500 and the 3500 are not the same truck at all in many ways.

Not true; the weights of the 2500 compared to the 3500 S.O. are almost identical -check the numbers, usually about 100 lbs difference. There is a FAR bigger difference in weight between a lower trim and higher one in the same model, than between 2500 to 3500 models.

The difference in sway is largely due to the inboard mounted coil springs on the 2500 vs the further outboard mounted leaf springs on the 3500.

B

 

[JohnandDonna]

I ran in to guy in St David Arizona, he had the Hemi 2500 long bed - similar TT(bumper pull) to yours in weight but he also had a 50" wide 2 seater SXS he carried on a bed flat deck carrier. He would have probably been over the payload with the diesel.

Probably would have been. I don't want folks to get me wrong. I think the Cummins diesel is a great engine, maybe the best by many accounts. It's just that most guys seem to buy them thinking they need it when most of the time they don't. If you have the money and like that diesel sound and torque then thats great. That is what personal choice is all about. I just feel bad when you see guys trying to put together enough to get a truck and then you see they are towing a 27' 6 or 7k heavy trailer. They go diesel because some salesman told them it was what they needed or some buddies told them its not a real truck unless it has a diesel. I always say if you tow heavy/often then a diesel is probably the best way to go. If you tow light (10 to 12k or less) and the truck is not a daily driver and will sit at times, then you should look at the gasser. But again, I think it's foolish to get that heavy an engine with the power it has and put it in a 2500. Whats the point? Go 3500 and you can make use of it all.

 

[sstoner911]

Not true; the weights of the 2500 compared to the 3500 S.O. are almost identical -check the numbers, usually about 100 lbs difference. There is a FAR bigger difference in weight between a lower trim and higher one in the same model, than between 2500 to 3500 models.

The difference in sway is largely due to the inboard mounted coil springs on the 2500 vs the further outboard mounted leaf springs on the 3500.

B

Well, my 2017 CC 2500 was about 300 lbs or so lighter than my 2019 3500 MegaCab....

Although leafs and coils also made a difference...that little extra weight can't hurt.

I use to compensate by filling my 36 gal fresh water tank with the 2500....haven't needed it with the 3500.

TBH I did not expect any huge stability improvement with the 3500 I was more focused on the payload difference.

I was pleasantly surprised on the day and night difference.

 

[kobra]

Well, my 2017 CC 2500 was about 300 lbs or so lighter than my 2019 3500 MegaCab....

Although leafs and coils also made a difference...that little extra weight can't hurt.

I use to compensate by filling my 36 gal fresh water tank with the 2500....haven't needed it with the 3500.

TBH I did not expect any huge stability improvement with the 3500 I was more focused on the payload difference.

I was pleasantly surprised on the day and night difference.

But that weight difference is between the CC and the mega cab, not the 2500 vs the 3500. So it's still not correct to say the 3500s are more stable because they weigh more.
I really think you are missing the point; the extra stability comes from the suspension. And that is both from the type of suspension and the geometry.

I agree that the 3500s are way more stable. Because of the suspension

B

 

[sstoner911]

But that weight difference is between the CC and the mega cab, not the 2500 vs the 3500. So it's still not correct to say the 3500s are more stable because they weigh more.
I really think you are missing the point; the extra stability comes from the suspension. And that is both from the type of suspension and the geometry.

I agree that the 3500s are way more stable. Because of the suspension

B

Well, I guess I should have been more specific...

I gained stability with a combination of a heavier MegaCab and leafs vs a lighter Crew Cab and coils.

I mean you can't ignore the weight difference..

Better?

 

[LossPrev]

Well, I guess I should have been more specific...

I gained stability with a combination of a heavier MegaCab and leafs vs a lighter Crew Cab and coils.

I mean you can't ignore the weight difference..

Better?

I kinda think you can ignore the weight difference. Do you think 300lbs means anything to a truck weighing 8000lbs+ and even in 2500 form is rated to tow 16,000lbs+ behind it? 300lbs is like a human carrying around a loaf of bread.

Not trying to be a jerk, just some internet debating!

I see this thought process every day on RV forums, Facebook rv groups and sometimes this site. "I have a 2500, I bought a 5th wheel with a pin weight of 2300lbs + me and wife in the truck. My payload is 1950lbs..."

The tow police come along and all start chanting "get a 3500! You're way overloaded!" And "you're going to hurt someone and be sued/go to jail" This sounds like ridiculous exaggerating but I literally read several threads/posts today that had these exact scenarios and comments

So guy needs to lose thousands on selling a 2500 to get a 3500 when he's only a few hundred pounds over on payload, in a truck with a GCWR north of 24,000lbs? That's insane to me...

 

[elephantrider]

No idea..,,,

Holiday? Are you british?

not british, but known to be sarcastic as hell.

 

[sstoner911]

I kinda think you can ignore the weight difference. Do you think 300lbs means anything to a truck weighing 8000lbs+ and even in 2500 form is rated to tow 16,000lbs+ behind it? 300lbs is like a human carrying around a loaf of bread.

Not trying to be a jerk, just some internet debating!

I see this thought process every day on RV forums, Facebook rv groups and sometimes this site. "I have a 2500, I bought a 5th wheel with a pin weight of 2300lbs + me and wife in the truck. My payload is 1950lbs..."

The tow police come along and all start chanting "get a 3500! You're way overloaded!" And "you're going to hurt someone and be sued/go to jail" This sounds like ridiculous exaggerating but I literally read several threads/posts today that had these exact scenarios and comments

So guy needs to lose thousands on selling a 2500 to get a 3500 when he's only a few hundred pounds over on payload, in a truck with a GCWR north of 24,000lbs? That's insane to me...

I will tell you some guys are more paranoid about this payload issue when it comes to pin weight. I have a coworker who traded his 2500 for a 3500 because he was 150 lbs over his payload....

Honestly I prefer to have way more truck to work with than I need. But I do see guys with 2500s pulling 3 axle toy haulers which start at about 17K dry and as much 23K loaded depending on what length and garage size they have.....etc...

You know they all exceed the load capacity....can it be done..sure...should you? It really just depends on what the guy towing wants to do. Some guys I know I would say send it....others I would say no because they really have no idea what they are doing and Iam surprised they have lived as long as they have.

Towing is one of those things that size does matter hahaha.

 

[sstoner911]

I kind of did the same thing...traded the 2500 for 3500 for more payload...I don't want to be limited in choices down the road both on payload but also towing capacity.

 

[kobra]

Well, I guess I should have been more specific...

I gained stability with a combination of a heavier MegaCab and leafs vs a lighter Crew Cab and coils.

I mean you can't ignore the weight difference..

Better?

Yes, better, but disagree on the weight - you can ignore the weight difference, and you should. 300lbs on these trucks, towing these loads is not the difference.
You could do it the other way around and compare a mega cab 2500 limited to a 3500 crew cab base model. The 2500 will weigh more. But the lighter 3500 will be more stable than the heavier 2500.

Because ... of the suspension.

B

 

[LossPrev]

For sure! I'd love to have a 3500 right now as we look at 5th wheels. Having extra capacity is a great thing. I just have no intention of selling my near perfect truck because I'll be over in payload on a truck "artificially" capped at 10k gvwr. I'm not selling this bad boy until the 1500 cab and a new transmission gets put on the HD models.

And I totally agree, towing a massive triple axle toy hauler with any srw is a terrible idea. Idk that I'd even want a drw 3500 towing some of these beasts. Maybe an f450 or 4500 at the very least

I also just saw this gem like 2 days ago on the toy hauler group I joined....

 

[sstoner911]

Yes, better, but disagree on the weight - you can ignore the weight difference, and you should. 300lbs on these trucks, towing these loads is not the difference.
You could do it the other way around and compare a mega cab 2500 limited to a 3500 crew cab base model. The 2500 will weigh more. But the lighter 3500 will be more stable than the heavier 2500.

Because ... of the suspension.

B

What about 3500 DRW? Vs SRW Both have leafs...

We can say wheelbase not suspension?