Is this 5th wheel too much for my 3500 SRW?

[BAT3500]

Another question, on the srw trucks, per the charts the HO trucks with the asin have the same axles as the SO. The payload is slightly lower with the asin due to heavier weight. Makes sense. But the gcwr is significantly higher with the HO. I get the benefits of the 4:10 ratio, but the tires and axle are the same which would seem to me to be real limiting factor. I would think the gcwr would be much closer.

On the other hand, for SO trucks, a drw has heavier axle and payload, but gcwr is almost identical between srw and drw....

 

[bfs673]

All great conversations!
Another thought to share:

The hitch you use can have an impact as well. My trailer (in signature) is a bit heavy for a SRW, in fact a bit heavier than the trailer you mentioned above. I've weighed fully loaded several times with my '14 3500 SRW using a B&W companion hitch weighed at ~200lbs. (Haven't towed with my '21 yet).
My numbers were close, but within manufacture parameters.

After moving to NY from Oregon, the campgrounds we use have a bit different terrain, caused me to install a slider hitch (~300 lbs).
With my '21, I'm going with the Reese goosebox. Gives me my bed back, and saves some weight. The goosebox weighs more than a standard pin box, however the combo (Hitch/pin box) is now less than my original combination, saving even more payload.

Weights below were with my '14 3500 SRW.
The GVWR on the trailer shows 16k... it's actually 16,700.

 

[DFHarley19]

My '21 3500 CC standard box SRW has a sticker payload of 3617 lbs. Engine is 6.7 HO. We're looking at a VanLeigh 320GK. Specs are below. We really like the trailer and it meets many of our wants including a length of 35' or less. On the other side, I want something that tows and handles well as we plan to do some cross country trips and I don't want that feeling of too much trailer for the truck. Wondering if this unit is really DRW territory.

VanLeigh 320GK

• GVWR : 16,000
• Dry Weight : 12,400
• Cargo Carrying : 3,600
• Width : 101"
• Height : 12' 11"
• Length : 34' 11"
• Hitch Weight : 2,600

Base on your comment, you will want to have DRW. FYI, I called my insurance and got a quote between DRW and SRW. DRW is cheaper by approximately $180 per year. I don't know if that helps you.

My wife and I love the Montana 3120rl and their GVWR is the same as yours and we ordered DRW HO.

 

[DevilDodge]

Another question, on the srw trucks, per the charts the HO trucks with the asin have the same axles as the SO. The payload is slightly lower with the asin due to heavier weight. Makes sense. But the gcwr is significantly higher with the HO. I get the benefits of the 4:10 ratio, but the tires and axle are the same which would seem to me to be real limiting factor. I would think the gcwr would be much closer.

On the other hand, for SO trucks, a drw has heavier axle and payload, but gcwr is almost identical between srw and drw....

GCWR is higher because of the engine transmission and transfer case. Those are the limiting factors on GCWR.

Look at the Hemi. It has the same GCWR for 2500 3500 SRW AND DRW. Because the engine transmission and transfer case are maxed.

Also...the only weigh to hit max GCWR/max towing number is with a gooseneck hitch.

 

[roegs]

All great conversations!
Another thought to share:

The hitch you use can have an impact as well. My trailer (in signature) is a bit heavy for a SRW, in fact a bit heavier than the trailer you mentioned above. I've weighed fully loaded several times with my '14 3500 SRW using a B&W companion hitch weighed at ~200lbs. (Haven't towed with my '21 yet).
My numbers were close, but within manufacture parameters.

After moving to NY from Oregon, the campgrounds we use have a bit different terrain, caused me to install a slider hitch (~300 lbs).
With my '21, I'm going with the Reese goosebox. Gives me my bed back, and saves some weight. The goosebox weighs more than a standard pin box, however the combo (Hitch/pin box) is now less than my original combination, saving even more payload.

Weights below were with my '14 3500 SRW.
The GVWR on the trailer shows 16k... it's actually 16,700.
View attachment 15475

BFS673....timely post. The 5th wheel in my initial post is difficult to find, so we're now looking at a Grand Design 310GK. The published pin weight for your Solitude 344GK is 2500 lbs. If I read the chart correctly you are seeing actual pin weights of 2750 unloaded and 3000 loaded. Those are good numbers that are fairly close to what Grand Design publishes. Do any of your weights include water? Some post that they travel with fresh water filled as it reduces their pin weight enough to get them in spec. Although that trick may work for the legal part, its a path that I'd rather not go down - I want my pin weight to be within axle specs without any special tricks.

The 310GK has a published pin weight of 2350, but as I read CAT scale posts of other owners, they seem to vary quite a bit with some saying their pin weights are over 3200lbs. This is the point where I get a little nervous as measured weights seem to be all over the board. I'm assuming that options on the 5th wheel along with packing contribute to most of this.

Also...looking at your sig, the new truck will also be SRW. Your 344GK is very similar to what we'd be looking at. Have you done much cross country towing?

 

[roegs]

Base on your comment, you will want to have DRW. FYI, I called my insurance and got a quote between DRW and SRW. DRW is cheaper by approximately $180 per year. I don't know if that helps you.

My wife and I love the Montana 3120rl and their GVWR is the same as yours and we ordered DRW HO.

Thanks for the note. As much as I'd like a DRW, its just not possible right now. Nice to know that I can use insurance premiums as part of my justification if / when I do my next upgrade though!

 

[bfs673]

BFS673....timely post. The 5th wheel in my initial post is difficult to find, so we're now looking at a Grand Design 310GK. The published pin weight for your Solitude 344GK is 2500 lbs. If I read the chart correctly you are seeing actual pin weights of 2750 unloaded and 3000 loaded. Those are good numbers that are fairly close to what Grand Design publishes. Do any of your weights include water? Some post that they travel with fresh water filled as it reduces their pin weight enough to get them in spec. Although that trick may work for the legal part, its a path that I'd rather not go down - I want my pin weight to be within axle specs without any special tricks.

The 310GK has a published pin weight of 2350, but as I read CAT scale posts of other owners, they seem to vary quite a bit with some saying their pin weights are over 3200lbs. This is the point where I get a little nervous as measured weights seem to be all over the board. I'm assuming that options on the 5th wheel along with packing contribute to most of this.

Also...looking at your sig, the new truck will also be SRW. Your 344GK is very similar to what we'd be looking at. Have you done much cross country towing?

I did one cross country trip, from OR to Northern NY.
Before the move, we towed a lot in the coastal range. Truck and trailer combo did very well.
My trips now are from NY to Virginia, Pennsylvania and other regional areas within 300 miles or so. The Solitude pulls very well and feels stabile behind my truck. I've hit some high winds in Wyoming and never felt pushed around.
Semis passing by do not push me around either.

The 310GK is probably the most popular Solitude in the line-up.
The general 5th wheel rule is to estimate ~ 20% of weight on the pin. At 15k, estimate 3k pin weight, and that gets you close.
How and what you load can also have a significant impact. Firewood in the bed, items in the front/belly storage, etc. generator, batteries (I went with LiFePo, saves weight and more energy).
I'm loaded pretty heavy (pull-out tray in belly storage, Green mountain pellet grill, cast iron pans, etc.)

I do NOT pull with water in the tank, unless absolutely necessary. I do put a few gallons in there in the event we need to stop for a bio emergency
The fresh water tank is slightly behind the axles, at least on my 344GK. So while that might relieve some pin-weight, I would not recommend it.

While a DRW is the better tow vehicle, the 310GK is within most SRW 1 ton pickups capability. I would be comfortable yanking it around with either my '14 3500 SRW or my '21 3500 SRW.

One consideration for you is the Solitude is a wide-body trailer (101" wide). Standard trailers are 96". This extra 5" does reduce turning capacity on short beds. Additionally, the Solitude pin box is not extended very much, bringing the cap closer to the cab. I was OK in most scenarios, and am always VERY careful about the cab clearance with a fixed hitch. I ran into an issue once turning into a campground off from a 55mph highway, the turn was over 90 degrees and sloped downward. This cause me to "kiss" the cab. Was done and immediately went to the slider. No issues afterwards

One more unrelated note; if Disc brakes are an option, GET THEM. Don't think about it, consider it, ponder it, etc. Check the box and move on

 

[Brutal_HO]

Another question, on the srw trucks, per the charts the HO trucks with the asin have the same axles as the SO. The payload is slightly lower with the asin due to heavier weight. Makes sense. But the gcwr is significantly higher with the HO. I get the benefits of the 4:10 ratio, but the tires and axle are the same which would seem to me to be real limiting factor. I would think the gcwr would be much closer.

On the other hand, for SO trucks, a drw has heavier axle and payload, but gcwr is almost identical between srw and drw....

The HO SRW has a 12" rear, 3.73 gearing. Only the DRW and Hemi trucks can get 4.10.

Unless they changed for 21, the SO has an 11.8" rear.

The HO has a higher GCWR due to the higher max tow, It's not just the Aisin, the xfer case is bigger too, as is the axle.

 

[Moose074]

Another question, on the srw trucks, per the charts the HO trucks with the asin have the same axles as the SO. The payload is slightly lower with the asin due to heavier weight. Makes sense. But the gcwr is significantly higher with the HO. I get the benefits of the 4:10 ratio, but the tires and axle are the same which would seem to me to be real limiting factor. I would think the gcwr would be much closer.

On the other hand, for SO trucks, a drw has heavier axle and payload, but gcwr is almost identical between srw and drw....

I belong to an rv forum and the topic of can my truck pull this trailer comes up a lot. Thru my research the HO gets the higher rating due to SAE J 2807. Being new to forum I am sure it’s been discussed before but haven’t seen it on this thread. My limited understanding of this is in 2015 most manufacturers agreed to use this “ test” to get the official towing capacity of the trucks. In over simplifying the test if the truck can’t accelerate/ maintain a certain speed in a certain distance on a hot day up a steep hill Davis damn road Arizona. Then it can’t claim that tow rating. So if the SO can only get to say 35 mph towing 20k in the required distance but is able to continue to accelerate up the grade while gaining speed. It can’t claim to tow 20 k even if it did. The HO with more torque can


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[Bombo]

I did one cross country trip, from OR to Northern NY.
Before the move, we towed a lot in the coastal range. Truck and trailer combo did very well.
My trips now are from NY to Virginia, Pennsylvania and other regional areas within 300 miles or so. The Solitude pulls very well and feels stabile behind my truck. I've hit some high winds in Wyoming and never felt pushed around.
Semis passing by do not push me around either.

The 310GK is probably the most popular Solitude in the line-up.
The general 5th wheel rule is to estimate ~ 20% of weight on the pin. At 15k, estimate 3k pin weight, and that gets you close.
How and what you load can also have a significant impact. Firewood in the bed, items in the front/belly storage, etc. generator, batteries (I went with LiFePo, saves weight and more energy).
I'm loaded pretty heavy (pull-out tray in belly storage, Green mountain pellet grill, cast iron pans, etc.)

I do NOT pull with water in the tank, unless absolutely necessary. I do put a few gallons in there in the event we need to stop for a bio emergency
The fresh water tank is slightly behind the axles, at least on my 344GK. So while that might relieve some pin-weight, I would not recommend it.

While a DRW is the better tow vehicle, the 310GK is within most SRW 1 ton pickups capability. I would be comfortable yanking it around with either my '14 3500 SRW or my '21 3500 SRW.

One consideration for you is the Solitude is a wide-body trailer (101" wide). Standard trailers are 96". This extra 5" does reduce turning capacity on short beds. Additionally, the Solitude pin box is not extended very much, bringing the cap closer to the cab. I was OK in most scenarios, and am always VERY careful about the cab clearance with a fixed hitch. I ran into an issue once turning into a campground off from a 55mph highway, the turn was over 90 degrees and sloped downward. This cause me to "kiss" the cab. Was done and immediately went to the slider. No issues afterwards

One more unrelated note; if Disc brakes are an option, GET THEM. Don't think about it, consider it, ponder it, etc. Check the box and move on

We have the 310GK with the upgrades axels and disk breaks. We also live in Colorado. I have a ‘19 dually as my daily driver and upgraded to a 50gal gas tank. It may be overkill but I’ve e never once worried about the mountains nor the wind. The stability is fantastic. The only downside is that I usually park a little farther away. Good for my waistline and minimizes dings from other vehicles The disc brakes are a no brainer!


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[Wileykid]

Re-weigh your truck with everything in it, ready to go, and see what the rear axle weight is. With my 3500, on the CAT scale, I have a payload of 3,400, and the rear axle has a "payload" of 3,600 lbs. The trailer I have on order will have a loaded pin weight (per several owners), of around 3,000-3,100 lbs. I am comfortable being 500 lbs under the max axle weight, or even 100 lbs. When I get the trailer, I will put it on the scale and see what my weight is, and if I am over, well, I will look at either a long bed, or a dually.

My new trailer was delivered to the dealer just a couple of days ago, and I was able to see it yesterday (delivery is the 10th). Factory weighed it at 13,078 lbs, and a pin weight of 2510 lbs., just about 19% pin weight as is (no battery, and no propane in the tanks). I will be changing the pin box to a Sidewinder, so that will add 80 (?) lbs, over the standard pin box. Over the last six years in my current trailer, the most I have put in weight wise is just about 1,400 lbs (heavier bike than I have now). So it looks like I will be within my weights on the truck. I will still be hitting the scale when I do load everything to see the real numbers, and if they are higher than I expect, a long bed, or dually will be in the immediate future.

 

[roegs]

My new trailer was delivered to the dealer just a couple of days ago, and I was able to see it yesterday (delivery is the 10th). Factory weighed it at 13,078 lbs, and a pin weight of 2510 lbs., just about 19% pin weight as is (no battery, and no propane in the tanks). I will be changing the pin box to a Sidewinder, so that will add 80 (?) lbs, over the standard pin box. Over the last six years in my current trailer, the most I have put in weight wise is just about 1,400 lbs (heavier bike than I have now). So it looks like I will be within my weights on the truck. I will still be hitting the scale when I do load everything to see the real numbers, and if they are higher than I expect, a long bed, or dually will be in the immediate future.

Can't stand the suspense - what kind of trailer did you get?

 

[Wileykid]

Can't stand the suspense - what kind of trailer did you get?

Grand Design 320G

 

[Stevejo]

As mentioned earlier, both Brutal and I basically have identical trucks. He has 3500 Limited and I have 3500 Limited Longhorn. Both are SRW. His is long box, and mine is short box. Both have same drive trains. He gets a GVWR of 12,300 and I get GVWR of 11,800. In theory my truck should be somewhat lighter due to shorter box, frame, etc. What parameter allows the long box to get an additional 500 lbs of GVWR weight?

I don't know why but I noticed that as well, and the mega cab is nearly as high as the long box. It must be the longer frame dispursing the weight further which allows a heavier weight. My opinion.