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GVWR Derating/Reducing

D

DoesRamCare?

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PREFACE: Don't even mention CDL laws, we aren't going there. I know what the laws are and this will spiral quickly if we start down that rabbit hole. Let's pretend they don't exist but I want a setup under 26k. I'm also on week 6 now of a leaking RAM sunroof with parts still 2 weeks out and am at this point hoping for a buyback. If Ram handles this appropriately I will be finding another RAM, if they don't I'll try another brand (that's a whole different discussion).

With that said, I've been looking around at my options and one thing that may force me into a Ford is the ability to have a long bed diesel with a GVWR under 12k. I tow a 14k trailer and now have an employee that does not have a cdl. I want them to be able to tow the truck and trailer, so a truck under 12k has now become basically a must. Both RAM and Ford have under 12k on their short bed offerings but I carry a transfer tank and all sorts of tools so a long bed is a must have.

I know I can register my vehicle at a lower GVWR (you can register it for whatever you want) but I want to physically have RAM change the GVWR allocation on the sticker and print me a new sticker so that when mr/mrs antsy state patroller pulls me over because they're bored I can demonstrate that the combined capacity of my tow rig and trailer are under the magic 26k.

So first question, I don't see this as an option on the Ram builder whereas Ford has a box you can check to reduce the GVWR to 11,400. Is there a way to do this on a built truck?

Second question, if there is one on the lot (Ford or Ram for that matter) with a GVWR over what I want can I have it reduced at the time of purchase?
 
Id just replace that employee or have them get their CDL much simpler option and a way better idea than even considering a ford turd..... that being said it does not matter what the door says if your ownership is derated the dot can not give you a hard time about it aslong as you are under the 26k when being pulled over
 
H3LZSN1P3R said:
Id just replace that employee or have them get their CDL much simpler option and a way better idea than even considering a ford turd..... that being said it does not matter what the door says if your ownership is derated the dot can not give you a hard time about it aslong as you are under the 26k when being pulled over
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There are a lot of reasons why I want to have a non-cdl setup but I won't waste your time with all of those. One of the biggest ones is liability though. I'd sleep better at night know that in the event of something catastrophic I couldn't be accused of towing without a proper license. Although unlikely I imagine could result in crippling costs to me if my insurance decided no to cover me because I was in CDL territory or if I hurt someone and they sued for the same.

Also, you're incorrect about the registered weight being the means of CDL criteria. GVWR is linked to your vin, state patrol has those figures as soon as they run your plates. Oh and this from my states DOL:
1612877395241.png
 
LateToTheParty said:
You can build a regular cab long bed 3500 with 11,800 GVWR with either SO or HO on the ramtrucks site.
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That's true, I should've mentioned I need the crew cab since we use the truck to tow our travel trailer with 3 car seats and a dog in the back.
 
H3LZSN1P3R said:
Where i am it goes by registered weight only why the hell would it go by highest weight if its not registered for that weight your state is stupid lol
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The whole thing is stupid I completely agree with you. I don't know the laws in your state but I doubt you can go buy a dump truck with a manufacturers GVWR of 54k, register is for 26k and drive it around willy-nilly without a CDL...
 
DoesRamCare? said:
The whole thing is stupid I completely agree with you. I don't know the laws in your state but I doubt you can go buy a dump truck with a manufacturers GVWR of 54k, register is for 26k and drive it around willy-nilly without a CDL...
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Im in canada but not saying you can buy a dump truck as that would be strictly commercial requiring a D licence but in a pickup with a factory box you can go up to 24,500 lbs without commercial license combined even if the truck can handle more your fine if your under weight with the truck gvwr registered at or under 14500 They go by the registration only never once have the checked my trucks rating
 
DoesRamCare? said:
There are a lot of reasons why I want to have a non-cdl setup but I won't waste your time with all of those. One of the biggest ones is liability though. I'd sleep better at night know that in the event of something catastrophic I couldn't be accused of towing without a proper license. Although unlikely I imagine could result in crippling costs to me if my insurance decided no to cover me because I was in CDL territory or if I hurt someone and they sued for the same.

Also, you're incorrect about the registered weight being the means of CDL criteria. GVWR is linked to your vin, state patrol has those figures as soon as they run your plates. Oh and this from my states DOL:
View attachment 11749
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Colorado has very similar CDL restrictions, with the only difference being those only apply when the tow vehicle is registered as a commercial vehicle.

I'm not sure what your business is, or what you would be having your employee tow using your truck/trailer, but if you don't absolutely need it to be a commercial truck (and your state has a similar ruling), maybe that would be an option?

Or as another option, could you have your employee apply for a Commercial Learner's Permit so they can train with you, then obtain their CDL? Clearly a longer timeline, but would eliminate that limiting factor.
 
LateToTheParty said:
Colorado has very similar CDL restrictions, with the only difference being those only apply when the tow vehicle is registered as a commercial vehicle.

I'm not sure what your business is, or what you would be having your employee tow using your truck/trailer, but if you don't absolutely need it to be a commercial truck (and your state has a similar ruling), maybe that would be an option?

Or as another option, could you have your employee apply for a Commercial Learner's Permit so they can train with you, then obtain their CDL? Clearly a longer timeline, but would eliminate that limiting factor.
Click to expand...

We tow a skid steer and a mini excavator. The state makes it clear that the recreational "passes" go to RVs and horse trailers. We're moving equipment to make money so we fall under commercial.

We used to have a CLP program where your employer could sign you off to go take the test and get the CDL but they got rid of it last year, now you have to spend 160 hours in formal training (classroom and driving). It also costs about $7k between the course, license fees, medical cards etc. Also my insurance changes once we go that route. Long story short, limiting the truck to under CDL limits is a better value proposition for what we do. This is also a side business for me (I have a full time desk job and do this on the side) so a lot of the employees I use are seasonal in the busy summer months and I want the ability to hire good employees that may be younger and most likely don't have a CDL (the right college kids have been the best employees to date).

Good thoughts though, thanks. It's hard to be a small business trying to play by the "rules."
 
This is very confusing. I am not really sure what you are asking

2500 crew cab long bed has 10k GVWR.

26k total would be truck and trailer.


Getting a lower GVWR doesn't help not exceeding 26k. The weight of the truck and occupants will not weight 12k...i am not understanding.

So the base weight of a 2500 crew diesel long bed would be about 8000lbs. So still leaving 18000 for trailer.

I do not get what you are asking. Lowering the GVWR has nothing to do with not exceeding 26k.


You would need to get a gasser 2500 to get the lowest weight

What am I missing?
 
DoesRamCare? said:
PREFACE: Don't even mention CDL laws, we aren't going there. I know what the laws are and this will spiral quickly if we start down that rabbit hole. Let's pretend they don't exist but I want a setup under 26k. I'm also on week 6 now of a leaking RAM sunroof with parts still 2 weeks out and am at this point hoping for a buyback. If Ram handles this appropriately I will be finding another RAM, if they don't I'll try another brand (that's a whole different discussion).

With that said, I've been looking around at my options and one thing that may force me into a Ford is the ability to have a long bed diesel with a GVWR under 12k. I tow a 14k trailer and now have an employee that does not have a cdl. I want them to be able to tow the truck and trailer, so a truck under 12k has now become basically a must. Both RAM and Ford have under 12k on their short bed offerings but I carry a transfer tank and all sorts of tools so a long bed is a must have.

I know I can register my vehicle at a lower GVWR (you can register it for whatever you want) but I want to physically have RAM change the GVWR allocation on the sticker and print me a new sticker so that when mr/mrs antsy state patroller pulls me over because they're bored I can demonstrate that the combined capacity of my tow rig and trailer are under the magic 26k.

So first question, I don't see this as an option on the Ram builder whereas Ford has a box you can check to reduce the GVWR to 11,400. Is there a way to do this on a built truck?

Second question, if there is one on the lot (Ford or Ram for that matter) with a GVWR over what I want can I have it reduced at the time of purchase?
Click to expand...
RAM 2500s with cummins can legally tow a 14k trailer and of course have the 10k GVWR. With a lower trim level you may have enough payload also. Have you run the numbers on a 2500 cummins?
If the numbers work, the RAM 2500 is the nicest riding truck in its class.

B
 
kobra said:
RAM 2500s with cummins can legally tow a 14k trailer and of course have the 10k GVWR. With a lower trim level you may have enough payload also. Have you run the numbers on a 2500 cummins?
If the numbers work, the RAM 2500 is the nicest riding truck in its class.

B
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Ummm my 2500 cummins is rated at 17.5k towing
 
Was trying to keep this simple. To clarify I have a couple of trailers, up to one that is 20k gvwr. I can’t afford 2 trucks nor do I want to store insure maintain etc. so a 2500 isn’t a good option as they will struggle with the larger trailers and I’m not buying anything without the aisin, my dad has gone through 3 rebuilds on his truck with a 68rfe and he isn’t out of the norm.

Ford offers a no cost “package” that lowers the gvwr on a long bed f-350 srw from 12,400 to 11,400 which still offers just over 3k payload which gives me plenty of room for tongue weight and tools/fuel.

The question was whether Ram had something similar. They don’t. I talked with state patrol and the ntea (national work truck association) today and it can’t be done. Gvwr has to be set when the vin is created. It blows my mind that Ford is the only one that offers this but judging by the comments I’m the only one with this conundrum.

I also got word today that Ram is cutting me a generous check for the hassle I’ve had with my 2020 Ram. It’s enough that with trade in I won’t lose much of what I paid for it.

I ordered the F-350 today. Bummer cause I’ve loved my Rams but the Ford just ticks all of the boxes in this case.
 
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