It’s just that since you can’t get the telescoping or utility lights to function without using a 2023 bcm, there’s no need to even buy and install the factory telescoping mirror switch, just leave your original power convex mirror switch in place (if you have one).
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2023 New Mirrors Conversion (Merged threads)
- Thread starter IndyRamMega
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jeepinmatt
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Perfect! Yes, I have the power convex mirror switch and will just leave it.
I have AlfaOBD and am familiar with it from my 2016 and 2017 trucks but haven't played around with the 19 yet. What kind of changes?
Also, is there only one door module for 23+, or does it depend on mirror configuration? I found these on a parts list earlier in this thread:
68590565AC23 left Door module
68590565AC23 right Door module
Thanks in advance for the help! I ordered the drivers side mirror last night, and once its up and working I'll move on to the passenger side.
Door modules are 68590564AC for passenger, and 68590565AC for driver side.
I actually have a used passenger mirror 68509726AE in mint condition available.
jeepinmatt
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I managed to make some progress yesterday and get the drivers side swapped. I went about it a little differently, as you'll see in the next post.
For my 2019 Laramie with chrome mirrors, blind spot monitoring, surround view camera, power convex adjust, and power fold, the parts list is as follows:
68590565AC Driver/left Door module
68509727AE Driver/left Mirror assembly
68590564AC Passenger/right Door module
68509726AE Passenger/right Mirror assembly
The mirrors were about $600/ea used in great condition, and the modules were about $80/ea from a dealer on ebay, so call it $1400 all in. I'll recoup about $1000-1200 of that by selling my excellent condition 4th gen mirrors, so other than the time and effort, not a big cost for the upgrade.
First thing was of course to lay them side by side and take some pics, since this is the internet after all.
The new mirrors are pretty close to the same width as the old mirrors folded in/down. As seen previously in this thread, the big difference is the addition of 2 bolts below the existing 3 bolt pattern, as well as the plastic trim hanging down about 2" lower to cover this area.
Based on my highly accurate and perfectly to scale dry erase marker tracing job, the simple square outline would be the lower line, and the finer shape that would be more difficult to cut would be the upper line that runs close to the bolts:
10 pics per post, so on to part 2...
For my 2019 Laramie with chrome mirrors, blind spot monitoring, surround view camera, power convex adjust, and power fold, the parts list is as follows:
68590565AC Driver/left Door module
68509727AE Driver/left Mirror assembly
68590564AC Passenger/right Door module
68509726AE Passenger/right Mirror assembly
The mirrors were about $600/ea used in great condition, and the modules were about $80/ea from a dealer on ebay, so call it $1400 all in. I'll recoup about $1000-1200 of that by selling my excellent condition 4th gen mirrors, so other than the time and effort, not a big cost for the upgrade.
First thing was of course to lay them side by side and take some pics, since this is the internet after all.
The new mirrors are pretty close to the same width as the old mirrors folded in/down. As seen previously in this thread, the big difference is the addition of 2 bolts below the existing 3 bolt pattern, as well as the plastic trim hanging down about 2" lower to cover this area.
Based on my highly accurate and perfectly to scale dry erase marker tracing job, the simple square outline would be the lower line, and the finer shape that would be more difficult to cut would be the upper line that runs close to the bolts:
10 pics per post, so on to part 2...
Last edited:
jeepinmatt
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Before cutting up the truck or doing anything crazy, I just wanted to make sure everything was gonna work. So I laid the mirror in the floor of the truck, plugged the new module into the truck, and the mirror into the module and started pushing buttons.
Simple as could be, main mirror and convex mirror both worked perfectly, power fold did its thing, yeehaw! Hmm, wonder why the surround view camera isn't working, icon isn't even illuminated on the bigscreen...Oh, because its not plugged in, dumbass! 
Plug it in, look at the screen, still not working, just a black shadow at the drivers door. Harumpf. Oh well, maybe that was the part about AlfaOBD, I'll worry about it later. After sleeping on it, and worrying I bought a mirror with a defective camera, the next morning I realized I had the door open, and thats what it always does when the door is open.
Close the door, and boom it works like a champ!
In summary, the following functions work perfectly by simply swapping the mirror module (no additional programming or workarounds needed):
Main mirror adjust
Convex mirror adjust
Power Fold
Surround View camera
Puddle light
Turn signal (I haven't actually verified this one yet, but I'm just assuming it does since the more complex stuff does)
What doesn't work:
Power telescope
Rear facing spotlight
There are workarounds for these mentioned earlier in this thread, but they are not at all important to me, so I'm not worried about them for now.
So, what did I do different? I decided to modify the mirror instead of the door.
There is no good and graceful way to do this. But the same could probably be said of cutting the door panel too. I figure worst case scenario, I'm out a $600 mirror, but I could probably scavenge parts and get some of that money back.
I started with the sawzall (jigsaw actually, but either device will rapidly punch the mirror just fine) to try to get some big chunks off:
It was slow and bouncy, and just a pain in the butt, and kept wearing through my protective tape (I did ballast the protection with cardboard after the first wearthrough).
Once I realized that wasn't gonna cut it (harharhar), I did something even more primitive...I started drilling holes and then walking the drill hole to hole using the side cutting action of the flutes:
I'd like to take a moment and mention that I have a mill and lathe, and a nice vertical and horizontal bandsaw, and they are basically useless in this scenario, because there is no good way to hold the mirror assembly. I'd love to clamp it down on the mill and hog out some aluminum, but it just isn't reasonably possible. I also have a plasma cutter, but the collateral damage to the wiring and plastic bits would be catastrophic. So primitive garage tools it is! I actually found the best tool to be my Milwaukee M18 oscillating tool with a carbide blade on it. It was much more controlled than the jigsaw and left easier surface to clean up than the drill.
Once I got enough chunks of aluminum out of the way, I went after it with a flapdisc on the grinder, and it cut very easily and ended up looking halfway decent. With a little more deburring and a coat of black paint, this wouldn't look half bad:
The hardest part about grinding was making sure you didn't hit anything else, while trying to hold the mirror still with your other hand (third hand, because safety first, no one uses a grinder with just one hand!).
Once I had enough clearance, I mounted it up and it went on without issue. Plugged it all in, and good to go. As I stated earlier, the surround view cam works, however the images aren't perfectly aligned.
I have no recollection of how good or bad it was before, but the newer mirrors do have the camera angled a little more outward, so I expected it to be a little off. Since I've only done drivers side, it'll be interesting to see if it changes any once the other is in place.
I'm sure someone is thinking "oh man, with only 3 bolts instead of 5, and all that webbing removed, the mirror is going to explode and kill a bus full of nuns!" and what not. I'm sure if you try hard enough, you're right! Reality is the new mirror is a few pounds heavier, but the old mirror stuck out further and had a larger aero profile. I'm no expert on mirror mounting mechanics and the relevant static and dynamic forces, but I am a mechanical engineer, and I'm confident my 90lb son could do a pull up on the arm of this mirror. It is rock solid and will have no problem handling any reasonable forces that are thrown at it, just like the old mirror with only 3 bolts. Also, a critcal component to the strength is the formation of the bends and contours in the door that the mirror mounts to. By cutting all the sheet metal below the mirror, you are weakening the mount for your bottom bolts, which counter compression due to gravity, and fore and aft forces due to wind/accel/decel. Yes, there are more bolts, but that very top bolt is probably doing 90% of the work of holding the old mirror up, and 70-80% of the work holding the new mirror up. The additional surface area of the new mirror can comfortably transfer some of that load onto the door sheet metal, instead of having the 2 lower bolts float in space and possibly even overcompress and stress the bracket if they are not tightening against a flat surface. Also, I have zero concern for water leaks since the integrity of the sheet metal has been preserved, and nothing has been cut, so rust won't be an issue.
Plug it in, look at the screen, still not working, just a black shadow at the drivers door. Harumpf. Oh well, maybe that was the part about AlfaOBD, I'll worry about it later. After sleeping on it, and worrying I bought a mirror with a defective camera, the next morning I realized I had the door open, and thats what it always does when the door is open.
Close the door, and boom it works like a champ!In summary, the following functions work perfectly by simply swapping the mirror module (no additional programming or workarounds needed):
Main mirror adjust
Convex mirror adjust
Power Fold
Surround View camera
Puddle light
Turn signal (I haven't actually verified this one yet, but I'm just assuming it does since the more complex stuff does)
What doesn't work:
Power telescope
Rear facing spotlight
There are workarounds for these mentioned earlier in this thread, but they are not at all important to me, so I'm not worried about them for now.
So, what did I do different? I decided to modify the mirror instead of the door.
There is no good and graceful way to do this. But the same could probably be said of cutting the door panel too. I figure worst case scenario, I'm out a $600 mirror, but I could probably scavenge parts and get some of that money back.
I started with the sawzall (jigsaw actually, but either device will rapidly punch the mirror just fine) to try to get some big chunks off:
It was slow and bouncy, and just a pain in the butt, and kept wearing through my protective tape (I did ballast the protection with cardboard after the first wearthrough).
Once I realized that wasn't gonna cut it (harharhar), I did something even more primitive...I started drilling holes and then walking the drill hole to hole using the side cutting action of the flutes:
I'd like to take a moment and mention that I have a mill and lathe, and a nice vertical and horizontal bandsaw, and they are basically useless in this scenario, because there is no good way to hold the mirror assembly. I'd love to clamp it down on the mill and hog out some aluminum, but it just isn't reasonably possible. I also have a plasma cutter, but the collateral damage to the wiring and plastic bits would be catastrophic. So primitive garage tools it is! I actually found the best tool to be my Milwaukee M18 oscillating tool with a carbide blade on it. It was much more controlled than the jigsaw and left easier surface to clean up than the drill.
Once I got enough chunks of aluminum out of the way, I went after it with a flapdisc on the grinder, and it cut very easily and ended up looking halfway decent. With a little more deburring and a coat of black paint, this wouldn't look half bad:
The hardest part about grinding was making sure you didn't hit anything else, while trying to hold the mirror still with your other hand (third hand, because safety first, no one uses a grinder with just one hand!).
Once I had enough clearance, I mounted it up and it went on without issue. Plugged it all in, and good to go. As I stated earlier, the surround view cam works, however the images aren't perfectly aligned.
I have no recollection of how good or bad it was before, but the newer mirrors do have the camera angled a little more outward, so I expected it to be a little off. Since I've only done drivers side, it'll be interesting to see if it changes any once the other is in place.
I'm sure someone is thinking "oh man, with only 3 bolts instead of 5, and all that webbing removed, the mirror is going to explode and kill a bus full of nuns!" and what not. I'm sure if you try hard enough, you're right! Reality is the new mirror is a few pounds heavier, but the old mirror stuck out further and had a larger aero profile. I'm no expert on mirror mounting mechanics and the relevant static and dynamic forces, but I am a mechanical engineer, and I'm confident my 90lb son could do a pull up on the arm of this mirror. It is rock solid and will have no problem handling any reasonable forces that are thrown at it, just like the old mirror with only 3 bolts. Also, a critcal component to the strength is the formation of the bends and contours in the door that the mirror mounts to. By cutting all the sheet metal below the mirror, you are weakening the mount for your bottom bolts, which counter compression due to gravity, and fore and aft forces due to wind/accel/decel. Yes, there are more bolts, but that very top bolt is probably doing 90% of the work of holding the old mirror up, and 70-80% of the work holding the new mirror up. The additional surface area of the new mirror can comfortably transfer some of that load onto the door sheet metal, instead of having the 2 lower bolts float in space and possibly even overcompress and stress the bracket if they are not tightening against a flat surface. Also, I have zero concern for water leaks since the integrity of the sheet metal has been preserved, and nothing has been cut, so rust won't be an issue.
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Very nice! I think I would also rather cut up the mirror parts than the door. Thanks for the great write up!Before cutting up the truck or doing anything crazy, I just wanted to make sure everything was gonna work. So I laid the mirror in the floor of the truck, plugged the new module into the truck, and the mirror into the module and started pushing buttons.
Simple as could be, main mirror and convex mirror both worked perfectly, power fold did its thing, yeehaw! Hmm, wonder why the surround view camera isn't working, icon isn't even illuminated on the bigscreen...Oh, because its not plugged in, dumbass!
Plug it in, look at the screen, still not working, just a black shadow at the drivers door. Harumpf. Oh well, maybe that was the part about AlfaOBD, I'll worry about it later. After sleeping on it, and worrying I bought a mirror with a defective camera, the next morning I realized I had the door open, and thats what it always does when the door is open.
In summary, the following functions work perfectly by simply swapping the mirror module (no additional programming or workarounds needed):
Main mirror adjust
Convex mirror adjust
Power Fold
Surround View camera
Puddle light
Turn signal (I haven't actually verified this one yet, but I'm just assuming it does since the more complex stuff does)
What doesn't work:
Power telescope
Rear facing spotlight
There are workarounds for these mentioned earlier in this thread, but they are not at all important to me, so I'm not worried about them for now.
So, what did I do different? I decided to modify the mirror instead of the door.
There is no good and graceful way to do this. But the same could probably be said of cutting the door panel too. I figure worst case scenario, I'm out a $600 mirror, but I could probably scavenge parts and get some of that money back.
I started with the sawzall (jigsaw actually, but either device will rapidly punch the mirror just fine) to try to get some big chunks off:
View attachment 79494
It was slow and bouncy, and just a pain in the butt, and kept wearing through my protective tape (I did ballast the protection with cardboard after the first wearthrough).
Once I realized that wasn't gonna cut it (harharhar), I did something even more primitive...I started drilling holes and then walking the drill hole to hole using the side cutting action of the flutes:
View attachment 79498
I'd like to take a moment and mention that I have a mill and lathe, and a nice vertical and horizontal bandsaw, and they are basically useless in this scenario, because there is no good way to hold the mirror assembly. I'd love to clamp it down on the mill and hog out some aluminum, but it just isn't reasonably possible. I also have a plasma cutter, but the collateral damage to the wiring and plastic bits would be catastrophic. So primitive garage tools it is!
View attachment 79499
View attachment 79500
Once I got enough chunks of aluminum out of the way, I went after it with a flapdisc on the grinder, and it cut very easily and ended up looking halfway decent. With a little more deburring and a coat of black paint, this wouldn't look half bad:
View attachment 79491View attachment 79492View attachment 79493
The hardest part about grinding was making sure you didn't hit anything else, while trying to hold the mirror still with your other hand (third hand, because safety first, no one uses a grinder with just one hand!).
Once I had enough clearance, I mounted it up and it went on without issue. Plugged it all in, and good to go. As I stated earlier, the surround view cam works, however the images aren't perfectly aligned.
View attachment 79503
I have no recollection of how good or bad it was before, but the newer mirrors do have the camera angled a little more outward, so I expected it to be a little off. Since I've only done drivers side, it'll be interesting to see if it changes any once the other is in place.
I'm sure someone is thinking "oh man, with only 3 bolts instead of 5, and all that webbing removed, the mirror is going to explode and kill a bus full of nuns!" and what not. I'm sure if you try hard enough, you're right! Reality is the new mirror is a few pounds heavier, but the old mirror stuck out further and had a larger aero profile. I'm no expert on mirror mounting mechanics and the relevant static and dynamic forces, but I am a mechanical engineer, and I'm confident my 90lb son could do a pull up on the arm of this mirror. It is rock solid and will have no problem handling any reasonable forces that are thrown at it, just like the old mirror with only 3 bolts. Also, a critcal component to the strength is the formation of the bends and contours in the door that the mirror mounts to. By cutting all the sheet metal below the mirror, you are weakening the mount for your bottom bolts, which counter compression due to gravity, and fore and aft forces due to wind/accel/decel. Yes, there are more bolts, but that very top bolt is probably doing 90% of the work of holding the old mirror up, and 70-80% of the work holding the new mirror up. The additional surface area of the new mirror can comfortably transfer some of that load onto the door sheet metal, instead of having the 2 lower bolts float in space and possibly even overcompress and stress the bracket if they are not tightening against a flat surface. Also, I have zero concern for water leaks since the integrity of the sheet metal has been preserved, and nothing has been cut, so rust won't be an issue.
View attachment 79502
View attachment 79501
jeepinmatt
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Finished the passenger side this evening. Decided to just grind/sand it all instead of drilling and cutting. First I attacked it with a fresh 80 grit belt on the belt sander, which was super fast, but it was hard to get a good angle and I was worried about rubbing wires and catching the rubber edge gasket.
Then I spent like 15-20 minutes figuring out how to clamp it without damaging it. Ugh. I almost resorted to just building a jig to use the 3 bolts and mount it in the mill. Finally settled on a crappy but workable setup and went to town.
15 minutes of grinding produced 15 million particles of aluminum dust. I don’t even think that’s an exaggeration.
But it turned out good and didn’t take as long to get done in the end. With that said, I don’t recommend this method just because of the mess it makes. My whole shop smells like aluminum now and it will take months to clean everything on the welding table (mainly because it will be months before I actually clean it off haha).
For future reference, the plug configuration on the modules is the same on old and new, but here’s a couple pics in case anybody needs them.
Driver/left:
Passenger/right:
Also, door panel removal PDF is attached for reference. Hopefully all this is helpful to someone else and takes away some of the fear of the unknown. Let me know if y’all have any more questions.
Then I spent like 15-20 minutes figuring out how to clamp it without damaging it. Ugh. I almost resorted to just building a jig to use the 3 bolts and mount it in the mill. Finally settled on a crappy but workable setup and went to town.
15 minutes of grinding produced 15 million particles of aluminum dust. I don’t even think that’s an exaggeration.
But it turned out good and didn’t take as long to get done in the end. With that said, I don’t recommend this method just because of the mess it makes. My whole shop smells like aluminum now and it will take months to clean everything on the welding table (mainly because it will be months before I actually clean it off haha).
For future reference, the plug configuration on the modules is the same on old and new, but here’s a couple pics in case anybody needs them.
Driver/left:
Passenger/right:
Also, door panel removal PDF is attached for reference. Hopefully all this is helpful to someone else and takes away some of the fear of the unknown. Let me know if y’all have any more questions.
Last edited:
Just another option for others of what I ended up doing, because I had a similar thought process:
I did end up cutting the door, and I also drilled the holes for the lower two additional studs. These holes will go through the actual door structure stamping. So, what I did to combat the downward torque on the door skin is I threaded on a “stopper” bolt with a washer on the studs first, then adjusted them to where they hit the door structure stamping and the rubber gasket was seated good on the door skin. Then, you’re essentially “sandwiching” the structural door stamping with nuts on the stud on each side, and that makes the mirror more rigid for upward and downward force.
jeepinmatt
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This is a good way to do it, but guys who do it in a gas station parking lot wouldn’t do it that way haha.
jeepinmatt
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A few daylight pics to polish it all off. Looks just like a 2023+ truck at this point though.
dieselscout80
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Looks great.
I want to see how you connect/operate the power extending function of them.
I want to see how you connect/operate the power extending function of them.
jeepinmatt
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Haven’t done that yet and not sure if I plan to. I don’t have a camper or enclosed trailer, so the retracted position is fine for my needs.
jeepinmatt
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Day 1 of living and driving with the new mirrors, I’m very happy with them. One thing im wondering about: is there any way to adjust the surround view image? It’s like the side cams are twisted 5 degrees relative to the front and back.
Left front and right rear are off. Maybe an AlfaOBD adjustment? @Jimmy07 ?
Left front and right rear are off. Maybe an AlfaOBD adjustment? @Jimmy07 ?
You’ll need to connect to the CVPM in the radio module list and run the service calibration on the cameras.
jeepinmatt
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See, this is what the Internet is for! Not ads and stupid TikTok videos. Actual useful information shared amongst people who know to people who need it. And archived for the future. Thank you.
Aketay
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Besides looking cool, do you like the mirrors when you actually have to use them for backing up a trailer. I couldn’t stand them when trying to see the top of the trailer when backing near trees. The Dumbo ears are still the best in tight confines. After retiring my Ram and trying out a GMC, the mirrors are one of the only things that I miss.
jeepinmatt
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The coolness of the looks is obviously debatable. The older style look ridiculous when flipped out, but the newer ones are a bit too roundy and sleek for a truck in my opinion. With that said, like ^ said, there’s just a lot more glass and they work better. The shape of the convex is more natural and focused better, and the main mirror is a lot bigger. And I think the biggest fact that doesn’t get enough credit is that the drivers side sits about 30% closer, and the passenger side is about 20% closer, so the image in the mirror is literally closer to you, which makes a tremendous difference. The convex is about the size of a phone screen, so imagine looking at your phone 3ft away vs 4ft away.
gprguy
Well-Known Member
I think this thread is talking me around to doing the new style mirror conversion on my 2022 instead of staying with the old style when swapping to the black mirrors. Especially if it can be done without hacking my doors.
Is there any information on the wiring to control the utility lights and the power extension/retraction? Are there any brains in the mirror or are there just power/ground wires for the light/motor? If the latter, does anyone know how the truck controls the extend/retract? Is it timed, or does it look for the motor to stall when it reaches the stop? Or limit switches in the mirror?
Is there any information on the wiring to control the utility lights and the power extension/retraction? Are there any brains in the mirror or are there just power/ground wires for the light/motor? If the latter, does anyone know how the truck controls the extend/retract? Is it timed, or does it look for the motor to stall when it reaches the stop? Or limit switches in the mirror?