CP4 to CP-ISB21S3 (revised CP3) change for 2021 6.7L Diesel Trucks -- Merged Threads

[UglyViking]

What was their net profit?

Net income and net profit are often used interchangeably. I'm sure there is an important distinction there somewhere but it's not that important to us.

Net income ≠ revenue. Which is to say, for all intents and purposes their 8 billion (if true) was profit after all costs.

 

[JEI-CAN]

I dont know how much they are making money, but sounds anyway they are. And regardless if they are or not at the moment, one fuel pump recall for 1 model for 2 years is nothing for big car manufacturer. To put in perspective, for example Boeings 737 MAX "recall" is big. Total cost for that kind of problem is massive. For FCA, similar size recall would be like replace engine+transmission to all trucks sold last couple of years or so. Of course I cannot calculate any exact numbers to match damage to Boeing, but point is perspective, small fuel pump issue is nothing very big if we talk about mega corporates.

 

[kobra]

Net income and net profit are often used interchangeably. I'm sure there is an important distinction there somewhere but it's not that important to us.

Net income ≠ revenue. Which is to say, for all intents and purposes their 8 billion (if true) was profit after all costs.

Technically, the term for a public company "profit" is EBIT and that can be found in their SEC filings. EBIT for FCA was $1.4B for the group as filed for Q3, which was 8.8% of total revenues. Earnings should be released shortly for Q4. I cannot see an easy way to break that out by the RAM group, but perhaps others have found that.

Rather than "can they afford it", I am actually more curious as to how the impact of this forum (and others) are raising awareness within the RAM group. All corps now pay a lot of attention to social media as a measure of brand reputation, and if they feel this forum is indicative of their broader brand reputation, that might motivate them more than a potential short term hits to profits.
IOW, I think that the noise that has already been made here and the acknowledgement of that by RAMcares may be an indication that this is being pushed up the food chain. Of course, that is speculation on my part, but as far as I can tell - keep making noise, it just might be working!

B

 

[str_8_shot]

So, this is a CP4 pump correct? Only wondering because I've already had one failure at 6,200 miles, with 4 months of down time already...

 

[Epsilon Plus]

That's a CP4 symmetrical cam pump. The revised pump they used for a few short months.

Don't look at it straight in the dimple and no sudden movements. It will rooster tail glitter into the fuel system if frightened.

 

[str_8_shot]

That's a CP4 symmetrical cam pump. The revised pump they used for a few short months.

Don't look at it straight in the dimple and no sudden movements. It will rooster tail glitter into the fuel system if frightened.

Yeah, I think I've seen it before...firsthand! Really sad Ram had my truck in the shop from July 2020- Nov 2020 and its still running a cp4.

 

[exiledinaz]

Yeah, I think I've seen it before...firsthand! Really sad Ram had my truck in the shop from July 2020- Nov 2020 and its still running a cp4.

Did RAM have anything to say about your payments if you have any? I'd like to think it would be cheaper to do a CP3 recall and install. Fingers crossed.

 

[str_8_shot]

I wonder if they will replace the future CP4 failures with a CP3?

Did RAM have anything to say about your payments if you have any? I'd like to think it would be cheaper to do a CP3 recall and install. Fingers crossed.

Nothing, and I asked. I asked the original selling dealership and servicing dealerships both for a loaner, and neither would help me, this was back in August... my parts were not expected in until November 23rd. I was begging for help from Ram and they wouldn’t even return calls.

 

[NDanecker]

They could make whatever excuse they want, a good lawyer should be able to convince a Judge FCA/cummins knows there's a problem, which is probably part of the reason Ford hasn't abandon the pump yet. It'll look real bad for their class action suit if they decide to drop the pump, while they're fighting a case over whether or not it's defective.

First, I don't know any 'good' lawyers. They all lie somewhere underneath the lid to my septic tank or have already passed to the leach field. LOL

Switching a part can be for a number of reasons that include what others have already pointed out (customer satisfaction, part supply issues, etc). I doubt the part is 'defective' per say but possibly not compatible with the environment it was installed to. In other words, the fuel system as a whole may not filter particles sufficiently to supply the pump with clean diesel thus the failure. However, that is still on FCA to design a working package (or fuel system). Unless its a safety issue I doubt FCA will do a recall. Still cheaper to just replace failed pumps as they come in then do a mass recall which will officially tarnish their brand vs. unofficially tarnish their brand with high warranty claims. Both suck for the consumer.

I'm just glad they went back to the CP3 so I don't have to deal with this debacle.

 

[Xflight29]

I feel FCA would would benefit highly by changing or retro fitting pump instead of paying out $$$$ for repairs, room and board depending on your location rental of vehicle and one HIGHLY pissed off owner.

 

[NDanecker]

Although I agree it's a decision based on total cost. What is the cost to replace every 19 and 20 pump vs replace ones that fail including market share loss because of tarnished image or pissed off customer. Not ever pump is failing. Curious what the real number is.

 

[Epsilon Plus]

Not sure how people keep missing the connection between safety issue and sudden engine stoppage.

Y'all even tow? How'd you like that thing to spray glitter while you're hallway down the Grapevine, Davis Dam, Ike pass...etc with your family riding and a 10k RV pushing on you in tow?

 

[mra400ex]

Not sure how people keep missing the connection between safety issue and sudden engine stoppage.

Y'all even tow? How'd you like that thing to spray glitter while you're hallway down the Grapevine, Davis Dam, Ike pass...etc with your family riding and a 10k RV pushing on you in tow?

Agree. Engine stoppage at any time could be catastrophic. Loss of power brakes, steering and you can have 30,000 lbs out of control. Sounds life threatening to me!!!

 

[Cseybert]

Totally agree it wouldn’t be a fun experience.

 

[str_8_shot]

My wife and kids were driving mine on a curvy county road when it died... not a fun call to receive, when it just came back from the shop a day prior.

 

[NDanecker]

although I agree that it can be a pucker moment there are much worse conditions that do cause damage or crash during failure.

case in point.....what is the percentage of damage or crash from these cp4 issues?

 

[Xflight29]

although I agree that it can be a pucker moment there are much worse conditions that do cause damage or crash during failure.

case in point.....what is the percentage of damage or crash from these cp4 issues?

All it takes is one.

 

[leeroy300]

February 2019, my personal truck, 2016 1500 ecodiesel. Unknown during the event CP4 took a dump while starting on a road trip. Limped to local ram dealer. Tech found grenaded cp4 with resulting debris in the entire fuel system. Tech blamed water in the fuel, produced a crappy dirty sample of fuel, and all warranty coverage was denied. Did the sample actually come from my truck? Who knows, i wasn't able to witness when the sample was taken. Fuel tank was emptied and fuel disposed of before i informed of the situation and permitted to get a look.

Fuel receipts? Had them, didn't matter. Doesn't matter where you bought it, if FCA can claim any kind of fuel contamination all warranty coverage is lost, it is clearly written in the warranty coverage, even in maxcare plans. I strongly suspect this wasn't the true issue, or at the very least not resulting from the last fill up. I used the same exact pump less than 12 hours after i had originally filled up the 1500 to top off my 2500 so i could complete my original planned trip. I had no issues with the 2500 using the same fuel source to complete a 400 round trip.

Believe me or not, I don't care. 7k repair bill to fix the truck after which i promptly traded in.

I would try and say that their fuel filter system failed!

 

[leeroy300]

also a stalled engine in the dead of winter on an isolated road in Northern Canada can be life threatening

 

[Great White North Eh]

also a stalled engine in the dead of winter on an isolated road in Northern Canada can be life threatening

Ya frozen balls give a clear perspective of what is DANGEROUS and what is not .