Brand New 2023 2500 Ltd - Anyone seen this before?

[TomK]

I hate for my first post as a member of this forum to be a downer, but I am pretty down at this point. I will try to make this quick.

I took delivery yesterday of a new 2023 2500 Limited with the new power towing mirrors. Last night in the driveway I was playing with controls getting familiar with the many buttons, etc. I power extended both mirrors to their furthest extended position which is for towing. No problem, and then I retracted. Again, no issues.

Next I tried to fold the mirrors in toward the cab and the driver mirror folded as expected but the passenger window did not. Thinking it finicky, I repeated the process two more times observing that the mirror only moved inward about a half inch before stopping. Huh?

I got out and went over to inspect and found this. The truck was delivered without a blemish so this happened during the process of trying to fold the mirror in. I had my wife sit in driver's seat and activate the folding while I was next to mirror. It jams after that 1/2" of travel but you can feel the motor continuing to vibrate as if it was still trying to close but was jammed.

I cannot find anyone else online having complained of this issue but these power towing mirrors are new for 2023 and are not included on the basic build. Thus, the number of 2023 buyers with the same trim/towing package may not be high.

That said, I did find some posts about earlier models having a mirror binding problem but that does not appear to be the same as this issue.

I found the truck in Freehold NJ, bought it there and had it shipped down to me. I have an appointment tomorrow with local Dodge dealer service to try to put in a warranty claim on this. Not sure how cooperative they are going to be given the two pints of blood this truck cost are up in Freehold.

Any thoughts on what could have caused this?












Here is the truck in its glory, basic white Limited with Night Edition, Cummins, Ramboxes, air rear suspension, power side steps, all the towing tech packages including reverse trailer steering, and the plow prep kit which I did not need in Florida but I did not have a choice.

 

[superjoe83]

Something impacted that mirror, you can see scuff marks on the bottom.
I bet if you fish out the broken piece you will find a mark on it from whatever hit it

 

[AH64ID]

Something impacted that mirror, you can see scuff marks on the bottom.
I bet if you fish out the broken piece you will find a mark on it from whatever hit it

Exactly what I was thinking, no indications the mirror broke from binding on the motor.

 

[Back of me hand]

Something hit your mirror and busted it and now the pieces are jammed in the gears. Hopefully they will warranty it, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if they deny the claim due to accident(al) damage.

 

[TomK]

Something impacted that mirror, you can see scuff marks on the bottom.
I bet if you fish out the broken piece you will find a mark on it from whatever hit it

How and where is the question? I am willing to consider that, but there is no evidence of it, especially when you consider the following.

The car carrier guy drove it off his rig and to my feet. The mirrors were folded in when it came off the truck and I personally unfolded them before the walk around. No damage was noted by me (nor the driver but that might be expected) during the walk around. I drove the truck the 300 yards to my house and put it in the driveway when I started playing with buttons.

I paid for an independent inspection up in NJ before I closed the deal. There was no damage.

The transport driver did his own inspection before loading. The vehicle carrier was closed, not open, so it could not have been an impact from anything airborne during transport.

The mirrors were folded in when it was loaded, during transport, and when unloaded.

There is no other damage to the mirror assembly nor the truck. Given the location of the damage, if this was an impact, it could only happen while the truck was moving forward. If something hit is in reverse, the entire mirror would have been impacted.

Suppose for a moment that the driver hit his upright portion of his frame cover going in with the mirror folded, given how close it is to the body, how is there no further damage?

Also, note is it that only the lower edge, where the rotation occurs, is damaged and not the balance of the mirror?

How can an impact sufficient to do that damage no cause more extensive damage or marring of the surface?

What may not be visible in these photos is that it appears all of the pieces are inside the assembly and toward the mirror, as if they were rotated there by the mirror's movement. Would an impact that done that?

Believe me, I initially blamed the driver irrespective of my having done a walk around with him and not seeing such damage if it happened on his truck. He and I reviewed the photos and made all of the observations above.

As for "scuff marks", I am not sure to what you are referring. That "chunk" which appears at the bottom left of the cracked area appears to have been scalloped inward, not from an external collision. There are no other marks outside of that cracked area.

Pulling the pieces out might show more but I do not want to reach in there with a needle-nose and pull pieces out until the dealer has a chance to review as it is.

If you can consider the above and help me understand where I am wrong I am all ears.

 

[TomK]

View attachment 55663

Something hit your mirror and busted it and now the pieces are jammed in the gears. Hopefully they will warranty it, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if they deny the claim due to accident(al) damage.

That's the piece I referred to above. That section is not impact damage, it is sheared bu something. No crack, like a sharp edge gouged it.

Think about what would have had to hit that to create a shear that dragged that piece up and into the mirror. How does that happen without further damage to the truck? There is not a scratch on the body.

And again, the big hole was not noted during the walk around (actually, walked around it twice) and it was literally 300 yards to my driveway on a straight street.

Not looking to be argumentative, just using your input trying to figure out how I explain this to the dealer tomorrow.

 

[McHenry2500]

I'm inclined to disagree with those saying it was hit. An impact would have knocked pieces off, your photos show pieces binding up inside the housing.

It's possible the gears moving the mirror body pulled/pushed into the plastic and this is the result. I'd recommend to your dealer to completely disassemble the entire mirror housing and see if there are more pieces inside or if the gears/mechanism show some kind of defect.

 

[TomK]

I'm inclined to disagree with those saying it was hit. An impact would have knocked pieces off, your photos show pieces binding up inside the housing.

It's possible the gears moving the mirror body pulled/pushed into the plastic and this is the result. I'd recommend to your dealer to completely disassemble the entire mirror housing and see if there are more pieces inside or if the gears/mechanism show some kind of defect.

I try to approach this like Sherlock Holmes might, eliminate all of the obvious possibilities to get to what occurred. The lack of further damage beyond that precise point makes it tough to see how it was an impact. And that one external blemish appears to have been sheared up and into the mechanism, not pushed in from a broad outside force.

Again, I am open to suggestions of other causes that support the facts.

 

[TomK]

Photos driver sent to me of the truck in his carrier. Note that there are no internal vertical members and nothing at that mirror height to "catch" the mirror.






I tried to magnify this one but there is not enough detail in the darks to really see anything. That said, later I will go out and look at the driver's mirror when retracted to see what its profile looks like.

 

[superjoe83]

I wonder the driver snagged it on the ramp door cable, since those are the narrowest part of the opening.

 

[AH64ID]

Ramp cable or the door latch would be my two guesses, unless something like a mailbox was struck on the drive to the house.

The way the plastic looks in the photos make me think it happened in reverse. But that’s also photo diagnosis.

 

[TomK]

I wonder the driver snagged it on the ramp door cable, since those are the narrowest part of the opening.

Ah, now that is not something I considered. But if that was hit with enough force to actually break the plastic, how is there no other market on the exterior of the mirror? It had to be hit while moving forward and if a cable was hit, pressure would be put on cable and cable would what, yield a bit to mirror and make a friction mark underneath? I will go check out underneath for any evidence of that.

 

[TomK]

Ramp cable or the door latch would be my two guesses, unless something like a mailbox was struck on the drive to the house.

The way the plastic looks in the photos make me think it happened in reverse. But that’s also photo diagnosis.

We don't have mailboxes. New Florida development where all mail is delivered to a central kiosk, not to your home.

 

[TomK]

I wonder the driver snagged it on the ramp door cable, since those are the narrowest part of the opening.

You actually provided the first alternative suggestion that the cable caused that mark on the bottom of the mirror. Perhaps that is the friction point and was caused by the cable.

 

[superjoe83]

Ah, now that is not something I considered. But if that was hit with enough force to actually break the plastic, how is there no other market on the exterior of the mirror? It had to be hit while moving forward and if a cable was hit, pressure would be put on cable and cable would what, yield a bit to mirror and make a friction mark underneath? I will go check out underneath for any evidence of that.

There was evidence of a rub mark in one of your photos, I bet he hit the cable going forward, deflected the cable around the mirror arm, then when he backed up the cable dug into the piece that broke and pulled it outward/up and snapped it off

 

[TomK]

There was evidence of a rub mark in one of your photos, I bet he hit the cable going forward, deflected the cable around the mirror arm, then when he backed up the cable dug into the piece that broke and pulled it outward/up and snapped it off

I am not sure there were two impact.

First, I know that the truck was not loaded in NJ and unloaded in FL without any movement in between. Driver showed me another photo of a Porsche being forward of my truck and above you see a bike. That means my truck was at least unloaded and reloaded at least once. So 2X the opportunity to screw up.

As for the impact, I think there was one and that caused the plastic to crack but not break into the hole we see above. I can understand not seeing the cracked plastic, particularly given the driver was trying to keep my attention on the wheels, showing me how they secured the truck with straps.

So cracked, but not broken, when I got home and tried to fold the mirrors in, that's when a piece projecting into the mirror body got bound up in something else and then was torn away.

Thoughts as a theory?

 

[Firebird]

Looks like transport damage

 

[flan]

Looks like a denied claim as it was inspected upon delivery.

 

[TomK]

Looks like a denied claim as it was inspected upon delivery.

yeah, that's what he is counting on. he was quick to get me to sign the release and given I have never done it before, blame myself for not being more scrutinizing.

unless the pieces inside show cable damage which will make his denials more difficult given where else would it have come into contact with a cable?

 

[flan]

Have you tried to work that broken off piece out yet?