Death of Diesel

[Great White North Eh]

I’m not sure where people think they are going to find all these free/ low cst pixies to power their EV. The more people they can get hooked on the ‘’electric crack’’ the higher they are going to crank up the price of electricity. My electric cost has tripled in the last 15 years.

 

[kobra]

…how big would an Interstate electric truck stop have to be? What would the startup cost be for a piece of land and the amenities required to make a decent electric charge facility in Podunk, manageable for a Mom & Pop?

We have suffered The EPA cracking down on small stations and purveyors of fuel here over the last decades…has gotten to the point where I haul 15 gas cans just to hunt my favorite deer spots. Signs that say ”90 Miles to Fuel” plus the vast dirt it takes to get to those signs…electric will never be practical for folks that live in those far-flungs or our deer hunts, I believe that is part of the electric impetus. Anti-freedom and the concentration of humanity that provides easier control.

Charging stations are not needed for hydrogen fuel cell powered electric vehicles. And hydrogen fuel stations already exist and are being built out. Lots of info earlier in this thread about that.

Brad

 

[Poolmonkey]

Charging stations are not needed for hydrogen fuel cell powered electric vehicles. And hydrogen fuel stations already exist and are being built out. Lots of info earlier in this thread about that.

Brad

When that is practical and can offer me maybe 800 miles range without civilization and reasonably timed stops upon reaching same, will look into it. It def sounds better than goofy golf carting…hydrogen could at least be supplemented by portable tanks of whatever. Not concerned enough to know what, they won’t be able to price me out of real fuel anytime in the future. I don’t buy fuel, my customers do that for me.

 

[Firebird]

…how big would an Interstate electric truck stop have to be? What would the startup cost be for a piece of land and the amenities required to make a decent electric charge facility in Podunk, manageable for a Mom & Pop?

We have suffered The EPA cracking down on small stations and purveyors of fuel here over the last decades…has gotten to the point where I haul 15 gas cans just to hunt my favorite deer spots. Signs that say ”90 Miles to Fuel” plus the vast dirt it takes to get to those signs…electric will never be practical for folks that live in those far-flungs or our deer hunts, I believe that is part of the electric impetus. Anti-freedom and the concentration of humanity that provides easier control.

The govt doesn’t care about podunk, they prefer to herd us into city centers, where we are easier to control.

 

[jetrinka]

Coincidentally this is the solution if someone thinks that's electric cars are a pathway to government control. Get a horse!

Get a horse? How about they improve the electrical grid and it’s output before forcing us out of petroleum vehicles? They are already talking about rolling blackouts in various parts of the country because the grid can’t even support what is there already. Anyone who thinks current electric cars are green are kidding themselves. Could it get there? Sure! Is it there now? It even close…

 

[kobra]

Get a horse? How about they improve the electrical grid and it’s output before forcing us out of petroleum vehicles? They are already talking about rolling blackouts in various parts of the country because the grid can’t even support what is there already. Anyone who thinks current electric cars are green are kidding themselves. Could it get there? Sure! Is it there now? It even close…

Ok, I feel like I'm shouting to the wind here, but will try one last time... let me punch it up a bit, and make a bold prediction

This forum is hdrams
This thread is death of diesel
The replacement for diesel hd rams will NOT BE BATTERY!

So, you will NOT NEED TO CHARGE.
It will NOT impact the electrical GRID.
It will NOT vastly increase the weight of the truck.
It will fuel up at a fueling station, NOT a charging station.

If you want to know why I say this, start researching what the CEO of Stellantis has hinted at. Research what other car manufacturers have announced beyond lithium batteries. Research what JB Hunt is replacing their long haul diesel trucks with.

I'd like to see this thread start to focus on the most likely replacement for the "death of diesel" instead of focusing on the current lithium batteries that happen to power Tesla's and other Light Duty applications. That is NOT what our HD trucks need.

So, someone more educated than me on the topic, what do you think? Will HD RAMS get batteries? (I hope not). Will they use hydrogen fuel cells? (which have been in development for decades waiting for attention and money to be focused on them). Or is there another technology that will replace diesel?

Thanks!

Brad

 

[jetrinka]

Keep kidding yourself. Could it be that it actually has nothing to do with the environment??!! Someone, somewhere, is making tons of money.

 

[kobra]

Keep kidding yourself. Could it be that it actually has nothing to do with the environment??!! Someone, somewhere, is making tons of money.

Hmm, I didn't say anything about the environment. And of course someone is planning on making tons of money; that's basic economics, and those who see a trend and jump in at the right time make big money. Nothing insightful at all about your comments.

However, you didn't address anything I said, and you seem to have made no effort to understand the technologies that actually might replace diesel. So, who's really kidding themself?

Brad

 

[jetrinka]

My point stands. Diesel and petroleum are being demonized for no better reason than it is making someone a lot of money. The common explanation is that it is all about saving the environment - which couldn’t be farther from the truth. Honestly I’m not interested in arguing at all but I am interested in going and putting on my tin foil cap. Good day

 

[Brutal_HO]

OK, everyone made their point. How about just discussing the technology that the thread has taken a turn towards and take a pass on the conspiracy theories going forward?

 

[sanda]

Get a horse? How about they improve the electrical grid and it’s output before forcing us out of petroleum vehicles? They are already talking about rolling blackouts in various parts of the country because the grid can’t even support what is there already. Anyone who thinks current electric cars are green are kidding themselves. Could it get there? Sure! Is it there now? It even close…

We don't have enough power generation, water, or now food but we can allow 2 million extra people per year into the country. How does that work?

 

[kobra]

Hmm, it seems that conspiracy theories and advancing political rhetoric are more popular on this thread than talking about the technology that might affect our future truck purchases. There are actually some really interesting things that could be discussed here on this thread, and I thought this might be the place to learn. sad...

Brad

 

[TinGoatTravelers]

I haven’t gone back to read every post in this thread so forgive me please if this has been covered.

I’m not so sure I want diesel to die. I mentioned in the gas mileage thread that according to CSX, they can move one ton of freight 492 miles on one gallon of fuel. Isn’t that because their Diesel engines are powering electric motors? In other words, they are a hybrid.

Towing my camper, I’m 15,000# (rounded down) or 7.5 tons. So using that math, I’d LOVE to see truck manufacturers get something near that - in my case, that would be about 66 MPG of diesel which on a tiny 10 gallon tank of fuel would give me quite the range. Of course, trains don’t deal with traffic or steep grades as we do on highways, so let’s say they can only get 45 MPG. Here a 10 gallon tank would provide 450 miles of range, or a 15 gallon tank would reach 675 - and that tank would still be half the size of what’s in my Hemi….

Not being an engineer, I’m sure there’s some good reason why this isn’t a reality.

For that matter, wouldn’t water be a great fuel if there were an efficient way to separate the hydrogen from the oxygen?

There’s got to be some better answers than the inefficient way we do it today…

 

[H3LZSN1P3R]

I haven’t gone back to read every post in this thread so forgive me please if this has been covered.

I’m not so sure I want diesel to die. I mentioned in the gas mileage thread that according to CSX, they can move one ton of freight 492 miles on one gallon of fuel. Isn’t that because their Diesel engines are powering electric motors? In other words, they are a hybrid.

Towing my camper, I’m 15,000# (rounded down) or 7.5 tons. So using that math, I’d LOVE to see truck manufacturers get something near that - in my case, that would be about 66 MPG of diesel which on a tiny 10 gallon tank of fuel would give me quite the range. Of course, trains don’t deal with traffic or steep grades as we do on highways, so let’s say they can only get 45 MPG. Here a 10 gallon tank would provide 450 miles of range, or a 15 gallon tank would reach 675 - and that tank would still be half the size of what’s in my Hemi….

Not being an engineer, I’m sure there’s some good reason why this isn’t a reality.

For that matter, wouldn’t water be a great fuel if there were an efficient way to separate the hydrogen from the oxygen?

There’s got to be some better answers than the inefficient way we do it today…

If there is no money to be made, no research will be funded.

Years back there was an engineer who designed an engine to run on fuel vapor it got amazing milage (100mpg in a truck IIRC) but he was shut down and silenced very quickly

 

[kobra]

I haven’t gone back to read every post in this thread so forgive me please if this has been covered.

I’m not so sure I want diesel to die. I mentioned in the gas mileage thread that according to CSX, they can move one ton of freight 492 miles on one gallon of fuel. Isn’t that because their Diesel engines are powering electric motors? In other words, they are a hybrid.

Towing my camper, I’m 15,000# (rounded down) or 7.5 tons. So using that math, I’d LOVE to see truck manufacturers get something near that - in my case, that would be about 66 MPG of diesel which on a tiny 10 gallon tank of fuel would give me quite the range. Of course, trains don’t deal with traffic or steep grades as we do on highways, so let’s say they can only get 45 MPG. Here a 10 gallon tank would provide 450 miles of range, or a 15 gallon tank would reach 675 - and that tank would still be half the size of what’s in my Hemi….

Not being an engineer, I’m sure there’s some good reason why this isn’t a reality.

For that matter, wouldn’t water be a great fuel if there were an efficient way to separate the hydrogen from the oxygen?

There’s got to be some better answers than the inefficient way we do it today…

I think you raise interesting points indeed.
As to hydrogen separation from water? I believe this has been worked on, and the shipping industry could potentially be revolutionized from it... unlimited fuel source?? It's been a few years since I looked though, and the challenge at the time was that the energy required to separate the molecules was so large that the net gain from the resulting hydrogen fuel was small. IOW, I think you're right, it's about efficiency at this point.

Brad

 

[kobra]

If there is no money to be made, no research will be funded.

Years back there was an engineer who designed an engine to run on fuel vapor it got amazing milage (100mpg in a truck IIRC) but he was shut down and silenced very quickly

When I was a teenager, I met a man that I think might be the one you are talking about. I even tried one of his devices on my first car; a V8 chevy. It did get better mileage, but it also ran very rough when warmed up. And, the mileage I did see was about double the normal, not the 100mpg that was claimed. I took the device off and he graciously took it back. He has long since passed away, but he had at least a hundred other inventions that likely never saw the light of day. He was one of the most interesting folks I ever met, actually.

Now, we may be talking about 2 different guys as I think in the 70's there were a lot of fuel mileage devices out there... it was the first "fuel crisis" after all. Wonder what those folks would think of todays prices?

Brad

 

[steve49]

Cummins is developing a 6.7L and 15L hydrogen fueled engines, the 6.7L will be for our size trucks.

Cummins begins development of 6.7, 15 L H2 engines

Program aims to develop medium- and heavy-duty hydrogen ICE platforms for on- and off-highway applications

www.newpowerprogress.com

Also read an article of a Ford F150 Lightning owners experience towing a 6000lb Air Stream trailer, "When you plug in your trailer and set the weight, height, length, etc., the Ford system auto-calculates your mileage impact. I plugged in at 85 miles, and when I finished the calculation, it stated I had 54 miles of range with the Airstream."

It will be interesting to see how it all plays out, but I believe we'll be pumping gas and diesel for many more years.

 

[H3LZSN1P3R]

Cummins is developing a 6.7L and 15L hydrogen fueled engines, the 6.7L will be for our size trucks.

Cummins begins development of 6.7, 15 L H2 engines

Program aims to develop medium- and heavy-duty hydrogen ICE platforms for on- and off-highway applications

www.newpowerprogress.com

Also read an article of a Ford F150 Lightning owners experience towing a 6000lb Air Stream trailer, "When you plug in your trailer and set the weight, height, length, etc., the Ford system auto-calculates your mileage impact. I plugged in at 85 miles, and when I finished the calculation, it stated I had 54 miles of range with the Airstream."

It will be interesting to see how it all plays out, but I believe we'll be pumping gas and diesel for many more years.

Aw damn i was hoping the 15L was for our trucks…. Lol

 

[Firebird]

Aw damn i was hoping the 15L was for our trucks…. Lol

Man, our ball joints would crumble under the weight of that beast!

 

[Great White North Eh]

Had to read that twice…… missed the word joints.