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CP4 Fuel pump failure at 7200 miles and 6 months into ownership of my 2020 Ram 2500.

Epsilon Plus

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As long as you are a forum member PRIOR to having an issue you'll be ok. No regulars on any of the forums have suffered issues.

Some good chewy stuff here, especially the later pages with Denso pump and injector failures:


You can't escape machine failure risk. Kid Rock was asked why he and Pam Anderson didn't work out. He said, "find me a guy dying to get with a particular woman and Ill show you a guy dying to get away from her". Any one of these hyper complicated emissions saddled low sulfur eating diesel trucks is going to have risk.

Right now, RAM is stepping up and fixing the problems and I've yet to read about a denied warranty claim. They have the best HD truck on the road right now total package and for the lowest cost feature for feature.

Enjoy your badass HO Cummins and let the chips fall where they may. With any luck, you'll run to GM's L5P for $10k more, be sad it's so ugly, and still drop an injector set in the middle of nowhere.
 

Latebraking

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As long as you are a forum member PRIOR to having an issue you'll be ok. No regulars on any of the forums have suffered issues.

Some good chewy stuff here, especially the later pages with Denso pump and injector failures:


You can't escape machine failure risk. Kid Rock was asked why he and Pam Anderson didn't work out. He said, "find me a guy dying to get with a particular woman and Ill show you a guy dying to get away from her". Any one of these hyper complicated emissions saddled low sulfur eating diesel trucks is going to have risk.

Right now, RAM is stepping up and fixing the problems and I've yet to read about a denied warranty claim. They have the best HD truck on the road right now total package and for the lowest cost feature for feature.

Enjoy your badass HO Cummins and let the chips fall where they may. With any luck, you'll run to GM's L5P for $10k more, be sad it's so ugly, and still drop an injector set in the middle of nowhere.
True, mechanical failures on mechanical things are not going away, and perhaps the amplification provided by social media platforms of various forums creates a distorted perception of how big a problem actually is. But if a part's design changes, and problems stemming from that change follow soon after, there needs to be quick, honest, analysis and remediation. I am looking forward to the truck, but this gave me pause, so I'm reading, and asking questions to get a sense of what I'm up against with this.
 

RV_Goose

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True, mechanical failures on mechanical things are not going away, and perhaps the amplification provided by social media platforms of various forums creates a distorted perception of how big a problem actually is. But if a part's design changes, and problems stemming from that change follow soon after, there needs to be quick, honest, analysis and remediation. I am looking forward to the truck, but this gave me pause, so I'm reading, and asking questions to get a sense of what I'm up against with this.
In April I bought my 2020 RAM 3500 Tradesman HO Aisin dually, forget the build date. And I now have 5000 miles on it. I did buy bumper to bumper coverage for 7 years or 100000 miles. So I feel I hedged my bet.

I have also asked on other boards for folks who have 2019+ diesel RAM trucks. No one has reported issues. Scientific or proper statistical analysis? Nope. But neither are the numbers or failures reported on this board.

How many reported failures are on this board? What percentage do they represent of the numbers of diesels built and sold by RAM?

I have insurance to attempt to protect my stuff and i as best as I can. If it occurs, would it suck? Probably. Will it happen? I don't know.
 
D

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So, these pumps have been failing like this for the past 10 years, with no legal recourse for the owners, or did something change within the last couple years?
Yes, it has been a problem child on anything it is mounted to from the get-go. They can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig. It is a fundamentally bad design.
 
D

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In April I bought my 2020 RAM 3500 Tradesman HO Aisin dually, forget the build date. And I now have 5000 miles on it. I did buy bumper to bumper coverage for 7 years or 100000 miles. So I feel I hedged my bet.

I have also asked on other boards for folks who have 2019+ diesel RAM trucks. No one has reported issues. Scientific or proper statistical analysis? Nope. But neither are the numbers or failures reported on this board.

How many reported failures are on this board? What percentage do they represent of the numbers of diesels built and sold by RAM?

I have insurance to attempt to protect my stuff and i as best as I can. If it occurs, would it suck? Probably. Will it happen? I don't know.
My litmus test is simple. Dodge ran the CP3 from 2003 thru 2018, and there were seldom reports of CP3 failures, and certainly not swarms of them seeking class-action lawsuits. Plus, when a CP3 does fail, it, as a rule, does not become a glitter gun like a CP4 almost always does. Bolt on a new pump, and go, generally. Same ULSD fuel. Same fuel stations. Same cross-section of owners. And the early common rail Dodges didn't have the benefit of as good a filtration setup as they eventually moved to, with a separate water separator/filter at the rear. I had an '05. Zero issues.
 

RV_Goose

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My litmus test is simple. Dodge ran the CP3 from 2003 thru 2018, and there were seldom reports of CP3 failures, and certainly not swarms of them seeking class-action lawsuits. Plus, when a CP3 does fail, it, as a rule, does not become a glitter gun like a CP4 almost always does. Bolt on a new pump, and go, generally. Same ULSD fuel. Same fuel stations. Same cross-section of owners. And the early common rail Dodges didn't have the benefit of as good a filtration setup as they eventually moved to, with a separate water separator/filter at the rear. I had an '05. Zero issues.

I have not spent the time to go through this board, or any others, to determine the number of reported failures. Nor have I sought out to determine how many 6.7 diesels were sold 2019+ models. As to the lawyers, they are always looking for the next class-action lawsuits as that generates lots of profit for their firms. While the 'participants' in the class action ends up with nothing significant.
 

GTX JOHN

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My 2020 Ram 3500 HO blew the pump @ 7000 Miles/ 3 months old
Been in the shop for several months!
It has almost put us out of business.
 
D

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The way I see this, it's not a Ram/Ford/GM problem, it's a Bosch problem.
While true in a literal sense, I didn't buy a Bosch pickup. Ram/Cummins made the decision to use a component that has a history as a KNOWN PIECE OF CRAP for ten years or more. They get the black eye.
 

Latebraking

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While true in a literal sense, I didn't buy a Bosch pickup. Ram/Cummins made the decision to use a component that has a history as a KNOWN PIECE OF CRAP for ten years or more. They get the black eye.
And so did Ford & GM. Who makes a reliable alternative? Why haven't any of the manufacturers adopted a reliable alternative?
 
D

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And so did Ford & GM. Who makes a reliable alternative? Why haven't any of the manufacturers adopted a reliable alternative?
GM went to a Denso system a few years ago. They don't use the junk CP4 anymore.
 

Xflight29

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I just read a article that Toyota has a 6 million +/- re-call on a fuel pump issue that can cause the vehicle to die with out any notice and leave them stranded. This is what Ram and Ford should be doing just out of curtsey.
 

Latebraking

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GM went to a Denso system a few years ago. They don't use the junk CP4 anymore.
Ahh, okay. Do you run a fuel additive? If so, which one? I'm still waiting for my truck to come off the assembly line, so I'm trying to gather as much information as possible to be as prepared as I can to head off maintenance/reliability issues.
 
D

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Ahh, okay. Do you run a fuel additive? If so, which one? I'm still waiting for my truck to come off the assembly line, so I'm trying to gather as much information as possible to be as prepared as I can to head off maintenance/reliability issues.
I periodically run some Stanadyne. But, TBH, it's because my buddy sold his Powerstroke, mostly to get rid of the CP4, and he had just bought a case, so I bought it from him. I have used Stanadyne before, though, so I do think it's a good additive. Not trying to get into an additive war. I do not, and will not run it in every tank. I think it's just the luck of the draw with the CP4 lottery, personally.
 

Latebraking

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I periodically run some Stanadyne. But, TBH, it's because my buddy sold his Powerstroke, mostly to get rid of the CP4, and he had just bought a case, so I bought it from him. I have used Stanadyne before, though, so I do think it's a good additive. Not trying to get into an additive war. I do not, and will not run it in every tank. I think it's just the luck of the draw with the CP4 lottery, personally.
It seems the primary variable that does a pump in, is if there's water in the system. The Ram's system has a water separator, doesn't it? Is it not effective enough?
 
D

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It is a potential cause, but I don't know about primary. A water separator has limited capacity even on big trucks, so to be truly effective long-term it needs to ne drained regularly. How many people drain their separator on a regular basis?

The other thing with additives, from what I have read, is unlike many gas additives designed to emulsify water and carry it through the fuel system, we need a demulsifier, one that pushes water out so the separator can do its job. This is one of the reasons additives with any kind of alcohol or derivative are NG.
 

Xflight29

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I cant believe for a minuet that a small amount of water that is most likely found in EVERY fuel station is enough to cause the damage it does. How can anyone design a fuel system that cant survive something as a small amount of water mixed in fuel . it is 2020 not 1930. "CMON"
 
D

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I cant believe for a minuet that a small amount of water that is most likely found in EVERY fuel station is enough to cause the damage it does. How can anyone design a fuel system that cant survive something as a small amount of water mixed in fuel . it is 2020 not 1930. "CMON"
It doesn't take much to cause a lot of corrosion in the crankcase of the pump. While the CP3 is lightyears ahead in durability, even a CP3 can be taken out by water. It's a major drawback of using the fuel as lubricant for the bottom end of the pump. Put a quart or two of water in the engine crankcase and see what happens. At least there is much better chance of boiling off water from the crankcase. I am by no means defending the CP4, which to me is indefensible, and I totally agree that if the truck can only safely operate in laboratory conditions, then "it ain't much good".
 
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2Many12Valves

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I cant believe for a minuet that a small amount of water that is most likely found in EVERY fuel station is enough to cause the damage it does. How can anyone design a fuel system that cant survive something as a small amount of water mixed in fuel . it is 2020 not 1930. "CMON"
That’s the problem it’s not 1930 it’s 2020...
 

RVTRKN

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If water is found in the fuel, you can be stuck with the $20K repair. Keep all reciepts and log your fill ups.
 

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