2020 2500 Issues Please Provide Insight

[irishbuc40]

I've got a 2020 Ram2500 with the 6.7 Cummins with about 14,700 miles on it. It is now in the shop for the third time due to a mechanical issue. The first issue was that it blew through 1/2 tank of DEF in one day and was blowing white smoke out the exhaust unfortunately I don't have my service records with me and I cannot remember what the exact diagnosis was at that time, I do know it was related to the DEF system. About a week later the check engine light came on with the message "Service Diesel Exhaust System." The dealer told me that because of the previous problem the NOX sensor probably got flooded and went bad so it was replaced.

This past Friday I fueled up about 3/4's of a tank ($74.26) at my local station. Saturday I drove approximately 190 miles in total making 3 stops in, the truck ran fine the entire time. At one of the stops, I had to go to pack up some booths I was purchasing from a convention. I didn't realize my kids would not be allowed in once the convention ended and the cleanup began on the convention floor so I had to put my kids in the truck and let the AC run since it's so hot here in. The truck ran idle for about 3 hours. The truck started just fine and we began our journey home. About 20 miles in a warning light came on that read "Service Electronic Throttle." The truck started to lose power and would not exceed 2000rpm. That warning quickly went off and the same "Service Diesel Exhaust System" message from months ago warning came up. Shortly after, the truck lost all power and we crept off to the side of the turnpike. The truck started again briefly twice then died. During those 2 times it never sounded rough or anything, almost like it wasn't getting enough fuel with the "Service Electronic Throttle" message. After waiting over 3 hours for Dodge's roadside support that never showed, we had to call our own tow and were towed to the closest dealer in the area.

On Monday I received a call from the service department telling me they found gas in my fuel tank. I immediately said no I did not put gas in my tank. I specifically remembered putting diesel in, but went back to the gas station to have my receipt pulled, sure enough it was diesel I pumped. I was so frustrated from being accused of something I didn't do I went and spoke to my local service department and they suggested I open a case with FCA. Today, I get a call from the dealer and FCA telling me none of the repair will be covered because of the gas in. As previously stated I DID NOT put gas in the tank, if I did, it's on me I get it but I am baffled that I'm being accused by Dodge for putting gas in my tank. After speaking to the woman from FCA and mentioning the previous times the truck was in the shop she said there were (to my surprise) no previous work orders for the truck other than an oil change. She then noticed some "notes" stating the previous issues with the DEF system. Once she saw them she said she would speak to the dealer again and get back to me which as of now I haven't heard anything. I'm hoping they will look further into this knowing the previous issues. because it seems as if once they found this contaminated fuel they stopped and accused me of putting gas in the truck.

My question is how could the truck of driven smooth as ever for nearly 200 miles, and idled for 3 hours if there was gas in the tank?? Wouldn't the truck of knocked, clunked, banged, spit, sputtered or something long before driving 200 miles @80mph and idling for 3 hours? When I asked the dealer this question he says the truck could run a while if gas was mixed in with diesel, what's your thoughts on this? If it is a visible amount of fuel, or even the smallest amount, about how long would it take before any issues arise? They claim maybe the Wawa had contaminated fuel. If the fuel was contaminated at the station wouldn't it of shut down almost immediately. I've been to Wawa twice since and spoke to different managers who are not aware of any issues. If the Wawa had contaminated fuel wouldn't there be a line of other trucks here at the local dealership with the same problems? Is it possible the "gas" in the fuel could be DEF that maybe over-injected into the fuel system while it was idling? It doesn't seem there is an exact science to them knowing there is gas in the fuel other than holding up a clear jar, so how do they know it is gas. How do I know this dealer didn't accidently put gas in it trying to get it started? I'm sorry for the long post and I thank you in for taking the time to read this and for any advice or opinion you can provide me.

 

[jetrinka]

It would not have run with gas in the tank

 

[elephantrider]

absolutely would not have ran with gas in the tank. ask for the dip analysis. I'd also find a lawyer. get the fuel receipt and see if anyone filed any similar reports of gas in the diesel tank. get as much info ready as you can.

dealers.

 

[Brutal_HO]

@RamCares

No way DEF can get in the fuel system unless you pour it in. The two systems are not interconnected in any way.

If RamCares can't help, get your insurance carrier involved. They will pay for repairs and subrogate to the fuel supplier if at all possible. Keep your receipts.

 

[H3LZSN1P3R]

it would run on gas but sound god awful… i would like stated get the analysis report and also would be worth getting your own test done and grab a gallon of fuel from that station providing the tank bas not been refilled and get it tested…

 

[RamCares]

Hello @irishbuc40,

We would like to look into this matter further. To do so, can you please send us a private message with your vehicle's VIN as well as your case number if issued? Thank you!

Also, we appreciate the mention, @Brutal_HO.

Hannah
Ram Cares

 

[irishbuc40]

So after driving 1.5 hours to the dealer my truck was towed to last Friday to get to the bottom of this matter, I speak to the service agent I'd been dealing with. He tells me they "accidently fixed my truck," and they were going to slide the warranty in to Dodge to see if they would cover the cost. I then went on telling him about how much I had driven the truck and how long it ran, and could not believe there could be gas in it. He then brings me to speak to the mechanic who asks me what questions I have. I proceed to tell him about how far I've driven on this fuel and how the truck ran for hours, and that I could not imagine it would of ran so smooth if it had gas. He completely agreed, and asked why I was concerned about gas in the tank, he says "I never said there was gas in the tank, I said it was a diluted sample" looking at the service rep. The service rep then says "I'm such an idiot, I'm so sorry." He admittedly took the fact that the mechanic told him it was a diluted sample and just assumed it was gas. For 5 days this guy had me so frustrated I went my gas station 3 times to speak to the managers, my local dealership twice to speak with my service tech, 2 mechanics and the service manager, and caused me a whole lot of stress all because he was an idiot who didn't get clarity and do his job correctly! On top of all that he still didn't know what he was talking about when I walked in that morning. He said they were gonna try to "slide the claim into Dodge" to have them cover the cost, and I couldn't pick the truck up until it passed or else I would have to pay for the repair. Turns out there was a repair bulletin out on the truck, the mechanic tells me I'm all good to take the truck immediately, it was all covered by warranty. It was an issue with the injector pump where over time it cracks and metal shavings get into the housing and DEF contaminates the fuel system. He called it a STAR Bulletin or something. If anyone wants more info on it lmk, I can grab my work order.

So long story short is this week worth of STRESS, frustration and wasted time could of been avoided had my service agent actually done his job, especially when I repeatedly told him I DID NOT PUT GAS IN THE TRUCK. Maybe he could of asked the machinic a few more questions. Crazy thing is even my FCA agent didn't look into it any more when I opened up the case. It was just "well you are responsible for the repair because you have gas in the tank." So between dealing with the BS at this dealership, FCA not looking into the matter any more when I told them there was no way gas was in the tank, and Dodge's Roadside assistance leaving us stranded on the side of an interstate on a Saturday night for three hours before calling my own tow because theirs never showed, I'm not a very proud Ram owner at this moment.

This is now the third time this truck has been in the shop with a DEF related issue. Here is another thing I learned through all this that each of you need to make sure of if you bring your truck in for a warranty repair: make sure your dealer is filing your repair with Dodge in their system as a Repair Order (RO). Apparently my local dealer has not done that the previous two times it was in for repair, and the woman at FCA intially told me she didn't see it was in the shop the previous 2 times. For some reason the 2 repairs were only filed as "notes," which she tells me that if I'm ever looking to file the Lemon Law the agents will not see the notes, they only look at the RO's. In reality the truck has been in the shop 4 times, the fourth being to swap out the radio that kept freezing up which for some reason my dealer didn't file at all, not even a note about it. As a consumer, shouldn't I just trust that all this stuff is being taken care of the proper way? So now I have to waste more time going back to my local dealer to get them to properly file the repairs they have done on the truck. None of this is what I was expecting buying a brand new 2500 in it's first 9 months of ownership!

 

[H3LZSN1P3R]

It was an issue with the injector pump where over time it cracks and metal shavings get into the housing and DEF contaminates the fuel system.

What kind of nonsense did they tell you…. The DEF never shares any component that fuel runs through that can crack. DEF only goes from the in tank DEF pump to the SCR chamber on the exhaust there is litteraly no way DEF can get in the fuel system unless DEF was put in the fuel tank …. Either the mechanic is clueless or trying to blow smoke up your butt

 

[Burton12387]

Well, I could be wrong, but even a catastrophic failure of the DEF pump or system will just lead to “limp mode” which gives you x amount of miles to get to the dealer. Never just cause the truck to lose power and die…….

Also confirming that the DEF system in no scenario can enter the engine. It’s its own tank, and injected downstream in the exhaust further down the system then the turbo.

Your tech is either a crazy person, liar, or just horrible at explaining what happened.

If “metal shavings” was a main culprit of failure. fuel injection pump (not def) is what pops to mind…..

What does it say on your ticket as to what repair was done?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Rockcrawlindude]

TLDR but I hope they fix your truck

 

[Brutal_HO]

Let's see the work order.

This all sounds like a bad game of telephone with repair techs ( term used lightly) that can't explain repairs properly and/or an owner that doesn't understand the system enough to know when they're being lied to, or just plain misunderstands everything that's been said.

"DEF contaminates the fuel system." Is simply just not possible. They are isolated for each other and share only a plastic housing at the filler neck location.

 

[BikePilot]

Something got mixed up in the communication. Sounds like the injection pump failed (2020 was a cp4 which is famous for that)--nothing to do with def. I'd sell it or lemon law it. They went back to the cp3 style pump for current trucks and they should be much more reliable.