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6.4 Air filter Pre filter in Lid?

GR1MxREAPER

GR1MxREAPER

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Changing my stock air filter in my 2021 ram 2500 6.4 hemi and noticed it has another pre filter in the actual lid? Is this for emissions or why is it there as it seems it would really really choke the motor from getting air and cause a big drop in mpg I would imagine as the motor has to be struggling for air? Thinking about drilling out the rivets and getting rid of it and just running my new Airraid Drop in filter? Havnt seen this talked about so wondering what others are doing? All aftermarket air intakes of course don’t have 2 air filters so guessing it’s for emissions.

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Gondul said:
Charcoal pre-filter... marginal impact if you run your truck @6K rpm+.

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Yeah I seen that also. I popped it out. Mine was dirty and you couldn’t even see through it with a light.. definitely a problem and epa’s doing.. You gotta remember that car in the video has a tiny little air filter, and tiny piping going to the engine. This engine is a 6.4 and wants a **** ton of air. Watching some video of an idiot kid testing a 4 cyl tiny engine vs a 6.4 v8 is like comparing a moped to a Yamaha R1… it isn’t even close bro…
 
Wonder if this EPA choking hazard is why they don't suggest a oiled filter. The carbon filter is supposed to absorb hydrocarbons. I'm not personally a fan of oiled filters, just thought the warning sticker under the hood was a little radical.

@GR1MxREAPER thanks for pointing it out. I think some drilled out rivets are in my trucks future.
 
oppizzippo said:
Wonder if this EPA choking hazard is why they don't suggest a oiled filter. The carbon filter is supposed to absorb hydrocarbons. I'm not personally a fan of oiled filters, just thought the warning sticker under the hood was a little radical.

@GR1MxREAPER thanks for pointing it out. I think some drilled out rivets are in my trucks future.
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Could be.. Just reach your hand in through the tube opening with lid off and push in a corner and it pops out/breaks the plastic welded tabs. Really easy.
 
The filter/filterbox/prefilter on the 6.4 are massively oversized for the engine. They’re the same ones used on the 6.7 Cummins which moves a whole lot more air and even it has room to breathe (no pun intended) with this set up.

There are not gains to be had with any changes to the air intake system on these trucks, unless you’re running some massive blower on it.

Your drop in oiled filter is only going to increase dust intake into the engine, and potentially foul up sensors.
 
jsalbre said:
The filter/filterbox/prefilter on the 6.4 are massively oversized for the engine. They’re the same ones used on the 6.7 Cummins which moves a whole lot more air and even it has room to breathe (no pun intended) with this set up.

There are not gains to be had with any changes to the air intake system on these trucks, unless you’re running some massive blower on it.

Your drop in oiled filter is only going to increase dust intake into the engine, and potentially foul up sensors.
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You need to actually read the post for crying out loud. I didn’t change the air intake tube, the filter is a non oiled air filter, the pre filter/charcoal filter for sure affects air flow, and the air box is not the same as the cummins version as the ram air and active intake system is not anywhere near the same and the inlet duct is significantly bigger on the cummins… You can clearly see in the pics below let alone if you just look at both vehicles which thankfully I can right outside my house . So your batting about 0 for 6 there bud lol. Plz read next time instead of just saying random things.. you couldn’t be more Wrong if you actively tryed to be.. IMG_4703.pngIMG_4704.png
 
GR1MxREAPER said:
You need to actually read the post for crying out loud. I didn’t change the air intake tube, the filter is a non oiled air filter, the pre filter/charcoal filter for sure affects air flow, and the air box is not the same as the cummins version as the ram air and active intake system is not anywhere near the same and the inlet duct is significantly bigger on the cummins… You can clearly see in the pics below let alone if you just look at both vehicles which thankfully I can right outside my house . So your batting about 0 for 6 there bud lol. Plz read next time instead of just saying random things.. you couldn’t be more Wrong if you actively tryed to be.. View attachment 73602View attachment 73601
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I did read the post. I didn’t say you changed the intake, I mentioned it because it’s one of the things that many people change along with the filter expecting it to help.

I’ve never seen anyone install a non-oiled Airaid filter, and oiled filters were mentioned in another response to you, so it seemed a logical assumption.

The intake is the same with the exception for the angle of the air box output and the tube from the output to the engine, because the engine air input is in a different location. The rest of the box is the same.

And of course the carbon pre filter affects airflow, but what I’m saying is more air can flow through the pre filter (and the main filter, and the air intake) than the Hemi can use.

There is no benefit to changing any of it, unless you’re a company that sells air intakes or filters. Changing the filter to one that can theoretically flow more air will allow more dirt in. Changing to a filter that allows less dirt will flow less air.
 
jsalbre said:
I did read the post. I didn’t say you changed the intake, I mentioned it because it’s one of the things that many people change along with the filter expecting it to help.

I’ve never seen anyone install a non-oiled Airaid filter, and oiled filters were mentioned in another response to you, so it seemed a logical assumption.

The intake is the same with the exception for the angle of the air box output and the tube from the output to the engine, because the engine air input is in a different location. The rest of the box is the same.

And of course the carbon pre filter affects airflow, but what I’m saying is more air can flow through the pre filter (and the main filter, and the air intake) than the Hemi can use.

There is no benefit to changing any of it, unless you’re a company that sells air intakes or filters. Changing the filter to one that can theoretically flow more air will allow more dirt in. Changing to a filter that allows less dirt will flow less air.
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Dude no.. the way the air gets to airbox is different, the size of piping, the angle of air intake, size of main box, Depth of filter, lid shape, every part for the air intake is a different part number bro… so what your saying is not right…!! You said the intake size and amount of air is the same etc.. the main duct size is different.. that is the limiting factor to how much air can get into the motor.. so your whole comment is wrong like I said.. so plz don’t comment on this as you are wrong and continue to be wrong.. I don’t want to argue with you as you clearly can go look under the hood of both trucks (which I have both next to me) personal truck, buddies trucks, work trucks lol…) you can see they are not the same in any aspect of the housing or duct size or ram Air/active air.
 
jsalbre said:
Hey, it’s all good, don’t believe me or reality. Go pull the air filter out of both trucks. They’re the same.
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You didn’t say the only thing the same is the filter itself.. as you can see below you said most
Of the parts are the same.. I’m done with you bro. I’ve never met someone wrong so much and keep digging down and down and down to prove they are 1% right. Go to a dealer and open hoods on both and look as you clearly have no idea what you’re talking about.
jsalbre said:
The filter/filterbox/prefilter on the 6.4 are massively oversized for the engine. They’re the same ones used on the 6.7 Cummins which moves a whole lot more air and even it has room to breathe (no pun intended) with this set up.

There are not gains to be had with any changes to the air intake system on these trucks, unless you’re running some massive blower on it.

Your drop in oiled filter is only going to increase dust intake into the engine, and potentially foul up sensors.
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jsalbre said:
Hey, it’s all good, don’t believe me or reality. Go pull the air filter out of both trucks. They’re the same.
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They may fit… but stock part numbers ARE NOT THE SAMe! Below are the air filters that come from Factory for both trucks lol.. this is soo much fun proving you wrong on 100% of what you say lol..

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If you can't have a respectful, adult conversation without taking every post as a personal insult and getting your knickers in a twist, it's probably best you put anyone you don't want to interact with on your ignore list.

Stop reporting members just because you disagree with their opinion and the next one that flames a mod for "not doing their job" gets the boot. How's that for doing one's (unpaid) job?
 
GR1MxREAPER said:
They may fit… but stock part numbers ARE NOT THE SAMe! Below are the air filters that come from Factory for both trucks lol.. this is soo much fun proving you wrong on 100% of what you say lol..

View attachment 73616View attachment 73617
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I’m not looking to get too involved in this pissing match, but AB and AA are different part numbers (obviously) but they are identical in size. I am currently running a AA in my diesel for the last 8k miles with no issue.
 
The AA filter is for all HD gas and pre 07.5-18 6.7L Cummins trucks. Same filter.

The AB is the approved filter for 19+ Cummins trucks.

ETA: New (non-oiled) Air Filter part number issued by RAM for the diesel trucks: AF-68645327AA

The base airbox is the same size and volume.
 
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Wasn’t trying to get in a pissing match. He said “part numbers were all the same” just pointing out they weren’t.. that is the point of all that. As they arnt the same for any of the parts let alone all of them lol.. never said filter wouldn’t fit? It isn’t the same part number. End of story.. no need to comment anymore as we already got to the bottom of what this post was about. So any mod can close this topic then as I’d rather not argue anymore anyways.
 
Seeing this reminded me to test this out. So a little background of myself. I have ported cylinder heads for 20+ years now and owned a Dyno when I had my own shop. This is not the best test but gives some info about the filter system . I bought an extra air box top so I could do an A to B comparison of air filters. My Flow bench will not flow enough air to give an CFM rating on an air filter. My bench needs to see 2inchs of pressure to give A CFM number. I like to play with this kind of stuff and there is always something to find and is learn about. The factory air intake is a good design in my opinion. Cold air and ample flow. A gasoline engine is air starved so more air is usual a power gain. When the air is controlled by a computer you not see a change. ie drive by wire. On my truck I removed the carbon filter and run run the Larger Cummins filter. Also changer all the edges on the in let of the air box lid (OCD ). This was done as a comparison between between filters and changes amongst them. And I like messing with stuff.

So to test an open hole of 3.54 inch diameter pressure (this size was chosen as it will seal the best to the air box top) 1.19 inch of pressure drop.
The air box lid with the carbon filter 1.45 inch of pressure drop.
The air box with the carbon filter removed. 1.21 inch of pressure drop
OEM filter 57008652AA with carbon filter 2.30 inches of pressure drop. (397cfm)
OEM filter 57008652AA with carbon filter removed. 1.75 inches of pressure drop
OEM filter 6851754AA Cummins filter with carbon filter. 1.81 inches of pressure drop.
OEM filter 6851754AA with carbon filter removed. 1.52 inches of pressure drop.
 
When did they add this ****? I just pulled the box off my 2019, nothin!
 
We may need to start a poll to find out. I'm pretty sure it came to the 5.0 mustangs in 2022.
Based on @Dewey 's testing above (thanks by the way!) I can see why there could be some increase in HP in our trucks.
 
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