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Cummins caught emissions cheating - fined 1.67 billion mega thread.

MtnRider said:
Who said it is not? And if not "what" part are they replacing/removing? Where are you getting this information? Again, all the "news" at this point is suspect.

They even used this language in the article..

"Cummins allegedly installed so-called "defeat devices" They also used "undisclosed" defeat devices, seems kind of ambiguous to me


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The department said Cummins used defeat devices on 630,000 2013 to 2019 RAM 2500 and 3500 pickup truck engines and undisclosed auxiliary emission control devices on 330,000 2019 to 2023 RAM 2500 and 3500 pickup truck engines to cheat emissions control requirements.

This is what they are accused of and accepted when in agreement to the fine. It state “and undisclosed auxiliary emissions control devices on 330,000 2019 to 2023.
 
Adam06 said:
The department said Cummins used defeat devices on 630,000 2013 to 2019 RAM 2500 and 3500 pickup truck engines and undisclosed auxiliary emission control devices on 330,000 2019 to 2023 RAM 2500 and 3500 pickup truck engines to cheat emissions control requirements.

This is what they are accused of and accepted when in agreement to the fine. It state “and undisclosed auxiliary emissions control devices on 330,000 2019 to 2023.
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This is from the same article, again written by reuters (doubt they have a deiseal expert there)

The Department said Cummins allegedly installed so-called "defeat devices" to bypass or disable emissions controls such as emission sensors and onboard computers.

Again, all of this can be done without a single piece of hardware

Can you can point me to what part they are removing or replacing? Something direct from Ram/Cummins, not a 3rd party news article?

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MtnRider said:
This is from the same article, again written by reuters (doubt they have a deiseal expert there)

The Department said Cummins allegedly installed so-called "defeat devices" to bypass or disable emissions controls such as emission sensors and onboard computers.

Again, all of this can be done without a single piece of hardware

Can you can point me to what part they are removing or replacing? Something direct from Ram/Cummins, not a 3rd party news article?

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This article is from The NY Times. I’m not sure what part it may be . But the statement is from the department of justice. I would think if they already are recalling the 14-19 why not the newer ones. I know that would be in best interest of ram. They have trucks on their lots that can’t be sold now if not fixed. I think there is more to this we don’t know yet. But we shall see how this affects these trucks. They do have the dpf on so it would make me think that would plug up quicker with it cheating emissions
 
Adam06 said:
This article is from The NY Times. I’m not sure what part it may be . But the statement is from the department of justice. I would think if they already are recalling the 14-19 why not the newer ones. I know that would be in best interest of ram. They have trucks on their lots that can’t be sold now if not fixed. I think there is more to this we don’t know yet. But we shall see how this affects these trucks. They do have the dpf on so it would make me think that would plug up quicker with it cheating emissions
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I believe what they are after is Nox emmsions, that's why they named 13+ trucks as that's when they introduced DEF to the trucks and that would not effect (plug up) the DPF. The newer trucks have already had software updates to adjust this but there could be more to come?

We shall see. If it is an actual "device" it would be news to every tuner out there that has ever torn into one of these trucks.

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Hope it’s a easy fix, still waiting on 3 other recalls with none insight
 
2500ltd said:
I think they use device in the broadest sense. Doesn’t have to be a physical thing. It could be lines of code.
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I believe your correct, software is also considered as a defeat device means of altering. With the EcoDiesel scandel if I recall correctly, the issue was the factory software was turning off the EGR when the engine was under load, climbing a long hill or heavy towing etc. Since software controls the full operation of the drive tran I would suspect that first, and maybe a sensor second, but either way the combination of both still puts it back on the software. The days of vehicles free of operating issues are gone!
 
2500ltd said:
I think they use device in the broadest sense. Doesn’t have to be a physical thing. It could be lines of code.
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A defeat device is any motor vehicle hardware, software, or design that interferes with or disables emissions controls under real-world driving conditions, even if the vehicle passes formal emissions testing.

This is how they define it in the commie clean air act.
 
Adam06 said:
Not sure but every thing I have read says the 2020-2023 had an auxiliary defeat device and are working to address those years. It states the 14-19 have already been addressed with upcoming software update recall. So there is a difference I believe there is a physical recall for the 2020-2023. And they have not figured out a route to address them
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"Upcoming software update" meaning it hasn't been done yet. Been addressed means they have the "fix" already. The way I see it anyways.
 
It can't the the VB6 as many have rumored at the beginning of this thread. VB6 recall was out in 2020(???) and supposedly all the trucks sold after that have already had this issue addressed so there would be no mention of 2020-2023 trucks if it was VB6 recall.
I didn't want to do the VB6 but had it done at the end when my truck went in for a CP4 recall, they made it mandatory to do the VB6 if I wanted my HPFP swapped. Didn't change anything in the way truck drives or drinks fuel after VB6 was completed.
 
MEGA HO said:
Yeah sounds like it.
Good luck trying to get this done, most people aren't stupid enough to go and castrate their trucks willingly.
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What are our choices
 
Adam06 said:
It has three recalls the asin transmission is the big one has 7,000 miles . I have to take it in, I’m sure you would as well lose your warranty if you don’t.
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You can tell them you only want certain recalls done, the truck belongs to you its your choice. I have told the dealer not to complete certain recalls without issues
 
H3LZSN1P3R said:
You can tell them you only want certain recalls done, the truck belongs to you its your choice. I have told the dealer not to complete certain recalls without issues
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And you don’t lose your warranty? I’m sure if you have an emission problem they won’t fix it and you would be out of pocket for repairs.
 
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